The health-technology sector overlooks women and their bodies
the-pool.com
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As a runner and a parent, this might annoy me. However, is it really a sign of (concious or unconscious) sexism? Don’t men run with prams in the US?
On the other hand it would be a big surprise for me if the people that designed the Fitbit's period tracking feature did not include or at least consulted women.
Something else that surprised me is the bit about crash test dummies. I found it difficult to believe that no female dummies existed. A quick search showed that in fact dummies modelling females exist since the 70s. However it seems they were derived from the male dummies. It seems it really took many more years to design a female dummy from the ground up (although I found articles from at least 2006 about it).
https://www.gras.dk/products/head-torso-simulators-kemar/pro...
That's a great idea that's new to me, and I'm thankful to the author for pointing it out, and I'll suggest we add it. (In the Netherlands where it's flat, parents pedal their kids around in a Bakfiets. [2])
The program's content was mostly designed by a woman [3], so I don't think omitting pram jogging was a sexist decision on her part -- it's more that you can't think of everything, or keep up with every new trend that's happening (and if you try, the menus are way too long so the user interface is difficult to use).
I agree with the article that it's outrageously patronizing and sexist for Fitbit to tell women how soon they must get over their periods!
[1] https://turnaroundhealth.com/
[2] https://www.fresheconomicthinking.com/2010/06/bakfiets-is-au...
Maybe they just can’t track it.
I do agree, though, that this is more generally something indicating that diversity in teams working on software all kinds of people use is important. I think a father could just as well have helped out here, because I can’t imagine that you wouldn’t immediately think of pushing the pram as an activity you want to track if you were a parent heavily involved with your child. It’s obvious, really.
I don't have much experience with activity trackers though. Do they also have option for if you're carrying a backpack or not, and other similar minor consequential details?
Walking is usually on a finished, somewhat flat surface. Hiking - even in flat areas - generally have obstacles and uneven surfaces. Tree roots, branches with thorns, and so on. It isn't uncommon to do a bit of a climb either. If I'm in a good enough area, I might personally be crossing a stream on rocks. I'm guessing this has different output in the device: Steps taken hiking might not equal that on a walk, for instance, but may (in general) burn more calories.
I don’t know this for certain. I’ve never tried to use the hiking algorithm on my walking path to compare them.
So one would need to make sexist assumptions about activities (only females push prams) to interpret a sexist intent on the side of the coders (I don't like females, so no pushing pram activity!)? But isn't that kind of a circular logic requiring sexism itself to work?
What about pushing a shopping cart? Carrying your groceries up to the 6th floor, where are the activities for that? Are they missing because of all the coders never shopping themselves?
Imho this has much more to do with the threshold of "what constitutes a track-worthy activity?", there are probably hundreds, if not thousands, of rather mundane activities that could be added for tracking, because if you up the resolution enough even breathing is burning calories.
I certainly see a lot more women running with prams than men on the trail near me. The majority of childcare is still overwhelmingly handled by women.
> However, is it really a sign of (concious or unconscious) sexism?
This is exactly the sort of thing you'd expect to see in a sexist culture where women are either deterred from entering certain careers/sectors or forced to leave. If you don't have a lot of women around, you probably won't notice as many things that disproportionately affect women.
I think I see more solo men than solo women with pushchairs, though I've not paid that much attention so I might be noticing the men more due to them standing out to me because they breach some subconscious expectation/bias. Or maybe I notice more due to jealousy: one of the regulars is usually a minute or two faster than my best even with the pushchair!
(context for reference: I'm in the UK, and a middle-aged, single, happily childless, male)
Never attribute something to maliciousness when laziness can explain the phenomenon equally well.
You don't want to put too many irrelevant things in the menu or list of activities you can log, goal you can pursue, or questions you must answer.
The system can filter out some things that don't apply to you, like only suggesting pram jogging if you have small kids, but then it has to ask if you have small kids to know that, and it might leave out people who help take care of other people's kids. So should it also ask about those personal details? Should it ask for your home's geolocation so it can check if you live on a steep street, before suggesting you pedal your kids around in a Bakfiets, so it doesn't accidentally give you advice that leads to a heart attack?
So you have to balance what you put in with how much the system needs to know about you, and how many irrelevant questions and suggestions it's going to throw at you.
[1] https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/320758.php
[2] https://www.theverge.com/2018/3/13/17113096/fitbit-watch-per...
So the glass is almost empty. I get it.
If we set the bar higher than a minimum of 40% then we are quickly going into single digit percent of the population. There is very few professions with an exact 50/50 ratio.
Thank you for bringing attention to this very important point. From the tweet:
"FWIW this feature was led by women (product manager, head of product, engineering manager). I am not defending the design & I understand that it fails to meet your expectations. Fitbit isn't that big and the people there care a lot about helping people."
A later reply by a current employee: "Also, the algorithm development was led by a woman."
This is just another software flaw, not a demonstration of rampant sexism. I'd ask commenters here (in general, not replying to the parent comment) to curb their outrage. And if things like this really bother you, apply to one of our many open positions.
I take your comment (and the tweet I linked) as being correct about my assumption.
As a non-American (I am European) I am always amazed about how easily things like that are attributed to gender (non) inclusion in the USA. On the other hand, as a male I have to always wonder if I find these kind of reactions over the top not because I am not American but because of my gender.
More generally, there is a lot of sexism, at least in the U.S., which makes people more inclined to see it everywhere...it's a natural human bias.
1.) The implication that a statistical outlier not being represented is something that would have been fixed by having more female engineers.
How much of an outlier is it for a woman to have a period exceeding 10 days in length? 1 in 15? 1 in 100? Is it not relevant? Would the 14/15 women who are not themselves these statistical outliers be roughly just as likely as men to lack this information? Presumably they would have a chance to be exposed to it by family/friends/relationships, but isn't that the same for the men? This sounds like either a problem with the FitBit team having not done proper research, or this being such a statistical outlier that it's an understandable mistake. Do the programmers on a diabetes bloodsugar reader need to themselves have diabetes, or is it not reasonable to suggest that they should instead be as well informed as needed to build the product?
2.) The implication that the lack of employed female engineers has more to do with anything other than...the lack of female engineers.
3.) The fact that statistical outliers need to be represented in every application for the general public. If there was a nutritional application that didn't account for Celiac's disease, or a running app that didn't properly accommodate somebody's asthma, I'm not so sure that the right idea is to determine that this app needs to cover all such cases. There are market forces at work here, if there is a need for it, i.e. asthmatic runners who are unsatisfied with XYZ apps, then there is an opportunity. If you have longer-than-10 day periods, and FitBit doesn't change, you have a market opportunity. If it doesn't do well...there wasn't enough of a market. Or I guess we can just demand that all apps are built by diabetic asthmatic women to cover our bases.
Well, how long is the longest period that your female family members have had? Is this a thing you discuss with them?
> The implication that the lack of employed female engineers has more to do with anything other than...the lack of female engineers.
You're bothered by the implication that thing have consequences?
> The fact that statistical outliers need to be represented in every application for the general public.
You mean the fact that period trackers need to be able to track periods?
"We're building tax software. Should we get a tax consultant to look it over and identify problems?"
"We're building a programming IDE. Should we get some programmers on our design team? Should we maybe eat our own dog food and have our programmers use it internally for development?"
"We're building a screen reader. Should our QA team have some blind testers on it?"
"We're building a product that we're marketing to women. Should women be involved in building it?"
Sure you can get around these issues by doing extra market research, but in basically every other area of development we understand that it is an asset to have your designers and builders be intimately familiar with the problems you're trying to solve. The cheapest, most efficient way to make your design team intimately familiar with problems that women face is to hire women.
It's no different than hiring security experts if you're building serverside software - you want some people on your team to be an early voice of reason; to be able to raise their hand early in a code review or a tech demo and say, "Hey, just so you know that's an XSS attack vector," or, "Hey, just so you know I've actually had periods that last longer than 10 days."
I would instead blame it on the people specifying the product features for not knowing their market ( and that usually is someone like a product owner).
Note that i clearly agree that having more people inside the company actually representing the target audience is a plus, but that's just a general rule, it doesn't apply specifically to having more women in tech team ( which i think is a nice idea, if only because tech is an interesting field to work in and women shouldn't miss this opportunity)
I would. If you're building a stock trading app, why on earth shouldn't you hire at least one or two people on your design/development team that actually trade stocks and have experience with the current market?
It's not even a question of social diversity; it's just that you'll catch so many problems if you do - I can't count the number of times at my last job we ran into technical decisions about performance and algorithms where we didn't know what the right decision was because our dev team wasn't familiar with how the software would be used.
You can't user-test architecture, at least not without very long, very costly development cycles and refactors. It's valuable to be able to catch problems early. Even at a purely technical level, having a dev team that's unfamiliar with what you're building is a recipe for disaster.
Don’t you think that having women on the development teams might have helped catch the fact that voice recognition software didn’t recognize female voices before the software ever made it to QA, rather than after release?
On female voices not being recognized i'd like you to show me the article that tell this story, because it seems so obvious that i'm having a hard time believing it ( looks like something as obvious as understanding people speaking with different accents).
If i were a team leader honestly i wouldn't care about gender first. I'd be more interested in recruiting people from different weights, sizes, ages, maybe even races, and medical backgrounds first. And then, maybe gender would come into play.
For some problems gender is an important factor, for others it's not. The fact that this "gender" predicate divides the world into two half doesn't make it relevant per say. I could divide between blue eyes and brown eyes, or skin tan, or lactose tolerant, etc, and come up with fairmy big chunks.
Now I do agree that differences between men and women are indeed so important that it's an very interesting criteria in many topics. Although for some reason i don't think that's the argument you want to base your reasoning upon.
https://makingnoiseandhearingthings.com/2016/07/12/googles-s...
AI/ML inherits the bias from it's trainers - this is pretty well accepted.
It also fails to address the underlying problem that there are simply nowhere near an equal number of available female engineers as male engineers. Shooting for a goal of 50:50 ratio when that is not anywhere close to the ratio of the available candidates makes it mathematically impossible to not make other sacrifices...for what objective?
Your claim is that there are things that female engineers bring to the table that male engineers do not. My claim is that there is nothing a male engineer can do on the basis of their gender that a female cannot, and the inverse is equally true. In fact, I can't imagine a more offensive argument than saying "we need more female engineers so that our app is better at handling women's periods."
Airbags, for example: If breasts tend to get in the way, then the airbags aren't going to be as helpful for women or, alternatively, cause more harm to women simply because of breasts (I'm speculating the example, I don't know it to be true).
I guess Fitbit’s next step should be to recruit female testers to avoid Twitter mobs.
Take a look at the most recent web audio stuff that happened in Chrome. Bugs had been sitting open in the tracker for months before the code got pushed into stable - dev team didn't do anything about it until prominent developers started calling them out publicly on Twitter and news sites started reporting on it.
As a smaller example, I used to do API level maintenance on a software stack. I didn't get to prioritize whatever bugs I wanted - upper management did. I actually advised people who had breaking bugs not to just file something in the tracker, because I couldn't guarantee that I would be able to take time to fix it. On top of filing an issue, I told teams that had serious problems that they should go to a manager and explain that it was going to make them miss a release deadline.
Then I'd be allowed to take time off of the more flashy features that looked good in press releases to fix their problem.
There is at least a decent chance that somewhere on the Fitbit engineering team, someone is reading that article and saying, "finally we get to address this #?&x$ issue because now it's public enough to care about."
> I guess Fitbit’s next step should be to recruit female testers
Yeah, they should, because female testers are more likely to catch problems that will effect females. They should also hire blind testers to catch accessibility problems. They should also hire runners and joggers to test if their tracking is accurate in normal usage.
I'm not sure if you meant this as a joke, having people who are similar to your end users test your product is basically business 101.
A report may or may not result in a fix. A post like that might accelerate progress there (given some reach).