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Comment by Simulacra | Hacker News Reader

I'm curious if this is a direct result of the internet and smartphones. The two make us feel more connected, more global, but I think it makes us more isolated. I miss talking to my friends on the phone, and hanging out in the 90s. Everything, especially how humans interact, is so digital today.

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I'm one of those few people who don't have a smartphone (by choice) so I observe this behavior a lot because I'm often looking forward instead of down at a phone.

But, check this out...

Everyone misses that. All you have to do is initiate the conversation.

A few days ago I had a 30 minute discussion with a random dude on Swedish death metal bands because he happened to be playing a song from a band I know while I walked past his house. I've been walking for 5 years and this hasn't happened once, so I had stop and say something.

Every time I take the 90min train ride into the city I usually end up talking to someone for most of the way. I'm not a good conversationalist either or some super extroverted person. I'm just bored sitting on the train, and other people are too (even if they are flipping through their twitter feed).

It's prime pickings to start conversations because everyone is so deprived of it.

> The two make us feel more connected, more global, but I think it makes us more isolated.

My wife and I had this discussion the other day. Messaging or posting on FB or whatever is very flat. There's no depth to it at all. It doesn't replace hearing a loved one's voice or looking into their eyes or hugging them or even having a meal with them. When you go and you visit them and you see them, you realize how much you're missing and, yeah, it feels very isolating to realize that. Social media is a facade.

Maybe so, but when I'm done with work, I hang out with my bros and play games on Discord (before that it was Ventrilo/Mumble/TeamSpeak). It may not be face to face interaction, but we're super social and it's great for us. We're always meeting new people and having new voice interactions, which at least for me, is as good (or better) than hanging out IRL. It's still nice to meet up sometimes, but definitely not needed to avoid loneliness.

It's not like I touch my friends much when we're meeting up IRL anyway, and voice is more comfortable to me than being on video (or being visible irl), as I don't have to think about how I carry myself.

Tons of gamers do this and I don't think many of them are in the "lonely" camp. I'm not sure why voice channels haven't seen wider adoption outside of gaming.

In my last relationship, almost all our communication when we weren't together was by text. She really had no interest in talking on the phone.

When she finally decided to dump me, she did it by text, and refused to meet in person or even talk on the phone about it.

Social media interactions don't replace that though. Previously, if I wasn't hearing their voices or seeing their faces, then I wasn't interacting with them at all. Now I can at least see little glimpses into their lives without having to get on a plane.

My hunch is that this isn't the primary reason for such high loneliness though. If smartphone and internet use is contributing so substantially to loneliness, you might expect loneliness to be increasing across the world. I am not sure if that is the case, but I would be surprised if all other countries with equivalent internet and smartphone usage would have similar rates of loneliness.

Was looking for this response as it's the key point.

If you're going to make a hypothesis that A leads to B then you should at other countries that also have A (in this case, lots of smart phones and internet) and see if they also have B (in this case loneliness). That doesn't seem to be the case, certainly not anywhere near the rate in the US.

This basic practice refutes a really large percent of unfounded views, and so is really a good habit to get into when looking to explain things.

Could be a change in reference frame, facebook did make be super depressed because I kept seeing others photographic happiness. I'm not more social these days but being off social networks I spend a lot less time ruminating over it and do other things (even walking out).

Totally agree with this. When was the last time you were in line at a coffee shop? Everybody staring into their phones. Compare that with sometime from like the early 90s where conversations would start up between folks inline. All these people staring at their phones it looks like the eighties equivalent of a Twilight Zone episode

How often did you have a conversation with someone in line at a coffee shop before smartphones?

Edit: not that I'm against it. I've had a very friendly chat with people in a mechanic's waiting room. It's just vanishingly rare.

We’re also now augmenting the problem with bluetooth earbuds becoming more ubiquitous, even if they’re not actively being used.

At least for me I find it a bit more difficult to approach someone if I think they’re listening to something or on a call.

I'd sooner blame later marriage and lower fertility. It's people you (ideally) live with and are 100% committed too. Friendships can be tenuous, but family is putting your money where your mouth is.

There is a certain "herd immunity" to social interaction to the point that nowadays taking down your phone or your book will not make a difference. It's probably not caused by smartphones and media, but they have facilitated the trend.

There used to be a time when constantly looking at a smartphone was the odd one out. Now it's the reverse.

No need to be curious, there has been a ton of articles recently about this. By constantly being barraged by all of the best snippets of everyone's life, kids especially are more depressed, and socially inept.

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