The Oldest Building in Every US State | Hacker News Reader

The Oldest Building in Every US State

archdaily.com

173 pointsbloat123 comments

At what point is the Delaware Block House[1] still the original building[2]? You can see the roof was replaced recently, and presumably the rendering[3]..

[1]: Delaware, the Block House https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Block_House

[2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus

[3]: In the episode "Heroes and Villains" (Only Fools and Horses UK Sitcom), Trigger wins an award for having owned the same broom for 20 years. He reveals that it has had 17 new heads and 14 new handles, but insists it is still the same broom.

This issue has been debated at least since the time of Heraclitus (c. 500 BCE) as "The Ship of Theseus".

https://www.utne.com/mind-and-body/ship-of-theseus-identity-...

Doh! I see now that's what reference 2 leads to.

OMG, am I still I while all my molecules constantly replace?

(Yes yes, persistent neural structure... but, persistent broom structure?)

broom?

http://foolsandhorses.weebly.com/triggers-broom.html

Reminds me of the Ise Jingū shrine, which has been torn down and rebuilt every 20 years for 2000 years.

I am in possesion of George Washington’s hammer. The handle has ben replaced 15 times, the head 7.

Reminds me also of the opening of John Dies At The End.

https://imdb.com/title/tt1783732/

Georgia's is incorrect. The oldest in Georgia is the "Pirates House" in Savannah: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_oldest_buildings_i...

The article says it traces the “oldest intact building in each US state”. Wikipedia says that only a “portion of the structure [the Pirates’ House] was built in 1734”. It sounds like the latter doesn’t match their definition.

I'm not sure what their criteria is, as the part of the Alamo in their image was started in 1744 and never actually completed. (Depending on your definition of "completed," I suppose.)

The article isn't consistent, either - some of these are mentioned as having been jacked up and moved several times, whereas other claim to be the oldest building in the state on the same foundation, some are heavily reconstructed.

Same with the Jamestown church for Virginia, where only the bell tower has stood since the 17th century.

Except the listing for Montana is a ruin.

There's no way the Alamo is the oldest building in Texas. A cursory googlin' turns up this, for example":

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mission_San_Juan_Capistrano_(T...

Which says 1731, a few years after 1724.

I mean, the building they use for the picture of the Alamo was built in 1744. So the whole thing's a confusing mess.

Espada was the first of the Spanish Missions in the region, established in 1690.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mission_San_Francisco_de_la_Es...

They were wrong for Maryland as well. There is a house in St Marys that is from at least 1670

Neat post, but I was disappointed to see cartoons instead of photos of the buildings.

You can't even copy and paste the building's name to do a google search

Why are like Cliff Dwellings not used for all states that apply?

A cursory search gives me Montezuma Castle in Arizona.

I was thinking the same thing. It's an odd list. It may make sense to exclude cliff dwellings if the list should be the oldest buildings still being used. Still, old, well-made buildings are very neat even if not technically the oldest.

Well what's weird is that they have Mesa Verde for Colorado. So they're not excluded.

Didn't the natives have houses or did they just not survive the colonisation?

Two indigenous structures are listed; Colorado and New Mexico both have old pueblo settlements.

Many of the indigenous villages in the mid-Atlantic area were burned by the English for one reason or another. I suspect many permanent settlements elsewhere suffered similar fates.

So does Utah- Hovenweep National Monument is just inside southeastern Utah, dating from 1200-1300. I'm not sure why it wasn't listed.

The listing is "oldest intact buildings" and Hovenweep is a ruin. Though, I'd agree that the listing, as published, is a bit strange, given the Molalla Log House is also a ruin (collapsed roof).

Fair enough - but then we could also discuss the restored kiva at Edge of the Cedars. It isn't a replica, it is a restoration from the original structure. Would that count?

I guess the point being simply that it seems more thought could have been put into the states where Native American structures have survived.

I agree. It's a Euro-centric list, no queston.

Cliff Palace (the oldest one listed for Colorado) certainly isn't "intact". It's definitely a ruin.

That's what the page claims, not my words, so...?

Sadly, all the Mandan earth lodges in the great plains are reconstructions but still worth visiting.

Before I looked at Washington I guessed its oldest structure might be one of the indigenous people's wooden longhouses. But my guess was wrong.

This surprised me as well, as I was under the impression that most / all of what's at Fort Nisqually is replica / reproduction, especially given that it was moved many miles from its original location.

The Colorado and New Mexico buildings are from the native population.

I'm guessing a lot of them didn't survive.

A lot of white peoples' buildings didn't survive either. I'm actually kind of curious how different this list would be if Sherman didn't burn a bunch of southern cities during the Civil War.

The house I grew up in dates to 1840 and served as an armory during the civil war. Though this was in VA.

Probably would have only affected Georgia's listing, if at all.

Yeah, he didn't burn Savannah, which was by far the oldest city on his route. Atlanta wasn't even 30 years old when he burned it.

He was unusually kind when he got to Savannah. He burned a lot of stuff on the way though. Not sure if any of those places were of significance.

He also destroyed some stuff in SC afterwards.

After Georgia he went through South Carolina with the specific goal of destroying things to punish them for being the state most responsible for the rebellion.

A lot of the natives (at least in the NE and Midwest) did not live in shelter that were meant to last for hundreds of years. They lived in semi-temporary small buildings

'The Oldest Building' actually should say 'Oldest Known Building'. Hard to believe that in a country this large there aren't structures that are around (occupied or not) that are simply not catalogued in any way or don't fit with what the article considers a 'building'.

There are was a large city just east of St. Louis that existed 1000 years ago. It vanished long before Europeans came.

I don't know how a Personal Loans website is responsible for old building illustrations, but it worked, you made me look.

That personal loan website is where it was originally posted. The original was posted on July 3rd compared to the ArchDaily article which was posted on July 24th.

There is even a note about it at the bottom of the ArchDaily post.

This article was originally published by NetCredit and has been republished with permission.

Original: https://www.netcredit.com/blog/oldest-building-in-every-us-s...

Thanks. I missed that note.

Really cool illustrations!

Sure, but no one wants illustrations of houses. They want photos.

I agree. I would have liked to see photos also, but the drawings are nicely done!

Would be interesting to see a similar list for every country in the world.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_oldest_buildings#By_ag...

Europe's building are just a little older.

Well, like the saying goes "In America they think 100 years is a long time. In Europe they think a hundred kilometers is a long distance"

An interesting subset, the oldest continuously operating pubs: http://home.bt.com/lifestyle/travel/uk/britains-best-oldest-...

("oldest pub in scotland" has two different disputed entries ..)

The oldest 'man-made structures' in America are much older: http://articles.latimes.com/1997/sep/19/news/mn-34091

North America. The other Americas have ones that still have the title of oldest, such as Sechin Bajo.

:-) You are absolutely correct. I also like the 'tongue-in-cheek' phrase 'the other Americas'.

I'm currently sat in a not particularly noteworth house in England built in 1770 that is apparently older than anything in 22 US states..!

It's cool to think of former inhabitants hearing tales from the New World.

"apparently older than anything in 22 US states" Um, you do know that in 1770 hardly anything west of the mississippi and east of the cascades was settled, right?

I was hoping there would be Google Maps links for some of these, so I could look them up in Street View.

Unfortunately, typing the names of some of these buildings into Google Maps doesn't work.

In Washington State, Bellingham's "Pickett house" is "the oldest documented wooden structure on its original site in Washington.". http://www.historylink.org/File/20594

(The Fort Nisqually/Hudson's Bay granary was moved to Tacoma in 1934 and later 'restored'.)

In many of these states there are still buildings that were made by native Americans far before the ones listed.

Like what? There are two native American dwellings listed, but what are more examples?

On the very first state I checked, Arizona lists something from the late 1700s rather than https://www.nps.gov/moca/index.htm

New Jersey log cabin, for sale for $2,900,000:

https://www.weichert.com/73240434/

Hawaii seems wrong: there are fort like structures still standing that are obviously hundreds of years old.

Oldest building 1637. Sorry, but as a european I have to say: "Nice try" ;).

As the saying goes, Americans think 100 years is a long time, and Europeans think 100 miles/kilometers is a long way.

Never heard that before, but it rings true.

Our house (Americans) is from 1909 and we think its crazy how old it is.

Our friends from the Netherlands came to visit and informed us that the next day they would visit DC (2-3 hours drive) and then swing by the upper peninsula of Michigan the day after (20+ hours).

I first heard that in the 80s from SF writer James Hogan, who substituted "Brits" for "Europeans". I've been quoting it ever since.

My local cafe is older than that, I've never personally lived in a house older than about 200 years though.

A couple of weeks ago I had a pint at the Kirkstone Pass Inn [0] and was thinking about Triggers Broom [1]. The foundations of the core of that Inn date back to 1496, but clearly the carpets aren't that old.

At what stage does a building become new? Lincoln Cathedral was built in 1072, but rebuilt in 1185. The Man and Scythe (a pub) in Bolton was rebuilt as recently as 1636, but the front of the building is only 100 or so years old. The cellar probably predates the 1636 year, and there was a pub of that name in 1251. Exact details of when old buildings (which are still in use) are rebuilt are typically lost to history.

[0] http://www.kirkstonepassinn.com/about.htm [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus

Parts of my local are 600 years old, and there's a Roman road about 5 minutes walk away from my house. I'm always amazed when I look at an Ordnance Survey map and see the amount of tumulus (burial mound) and other ancient structures. We are surrounded by history but mostly unaware of it. I sometimes wonder about what's out there waiting to be discovered. Perhaps one day we'll have archaeological drones roaming around looking for undiscovered treasures.

You're living in the past. (-:

* https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12326425

Quite a long way in the past.

* https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17496989

* https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-44806069

* https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-4...

* https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17526492

That's not what I'm thinking of really - I should have been clearer - I was thinking more of something like the Mars Curiosity rover - autonomous drones, not necessarily aerial, probably solar powered, able to roam around on their own for months/years at a time looking for interesting stuff.

One thing that I love about Scotland is that there is so much ancient mysterious stuff about that rather little attention is paid to a lot of it e.g. Cademuir Hill near Peebles - impressive fortifications with stone cheval de frise and a name that apparently derived from the Gaelic for "the great fight". Who built the fortresses, who the "great fight" was between and when - nobody really cares that much. And that's in no way exceptional.

And then there are the forts where the walls were melted - by accident or on purpose - nobody is really sure:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitrified_fort

> Who built the fortresses, who the "great fight" was between and when - nobody really cares that much.

“No one, not even you, will remember if we were good men or bad, Why we fought or why we died. No, all that matters is that two stood against many. That's what's important.”

— Conan the Barbarian (1982)

The village I grew up in has a cliff sided promontory called the "Green Castle" - turns out that 1000+ years ago it held a substantial Pictish fort. As a kid I've picked bits of charred wood out from where one of the sides where it is eroding away.

Was it burned down by enemies (a Viking siege?), by accident or on purpose. Nobody knows.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Castle,_Portknockie

And there is also the (crazy) idea that I've had since I was a kid that the Tap o' Noth is Tolkien's Weathertop ;-)

An old jape, probably from the 1950s, heard from my father:

A tour guide somewhere in the US southwest stands in front of a building and says "This building is one of the oldest in the territory, a hundred and twenty years old. Think of that folks, a hundred and twenty years old."

A voice from the back of the crowd says, "I can't wait to get back to Damascus and tell them."

[edit: changed initial "And" to "An".]

Haha, my own house already 90 years old. I got married in my city's town hall which has been in active use since 1544. It's a different world from the US :)

The oldest building on the list actually dates to 1190.

about when my family's house was first document, and it's just an farm belonging to the church.

That's pretty cool. Hopefully it's gone thru some renovations over the years.

Nope, in Colorado there's a Pueblo building from the 12th century. It's there in the article

The oldest building in my city would be walls from somewhere around 0 BC. It was a rather important nexus for the Roman Army due to the geographic location. Though it's largely buried under more modern walls from around 13th century.

There is also social housing, build in the 16th century by one of the top 3 wealthiest people in modern history. Still in use today, about 1€ a year rent.

Nitpick I know, but there's no year 0 BC. Or 0 AD for that matter.

Well, it was more likely in the BC range, but yeah, would be year 0 instead.

Year 0 doesn't exist either. 1 BC is directly followed by 1 AD

Year 0 is obviously in the middle of the two.

Here you go: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_zero

Because zero wasn't invented until much later.

Hmm, I don't think so: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-is-the-origi...

Also, AD / BC wasn't devised until 525 AD, and zero was common at that point, so that can't be the reason: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anno_Domini

EDIT: Apparently I'm wrong :)

Neither the concept nor a symbol for zero existed in the system of Roman numerals. The Babylonian system of the BC era had used the idea of "nothingness" without considering it a number, and the Romans enumerated in much the same way. Wherever a modern zero would have been used, Bede and Dionysius Exiguus did use Latin number words, or the word nulla (meaning "nothing") alongside Roman numerals.[1][3][4] Zero was invented in India in the sixth century, and was either transferred or reinvented by the Arabs by about the eighth century. The Arabic numeral for zero (0) did not enter Europe until the thirteenth century. Even then, it was known only to very few, and only entered widespread use in Europe by the seventeenth century.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_zero

Forgot the sarcasm flag in that post..

The Taos Pueblos are 700-1000 years old and have been continuously occupied. It’s on the list.

Most European countries as they are now did not exist in 1637.

Well, Oxford University has been going for 922 years.

Some of the buildings have been updated a bit, however, at Oxford and plenty of other university/school towns in England there are buildings that are still used today for their original teaching purposes, having been built many centuries ago way before the Columbus story of 'discovery' was written.

So it's a competition where older is better? Even older than European buildings is the European attitude that leads them to add irrelevant comments proclaiming their superiority to every discussion on the internet.

I can promise you that's not an attitude limited to Europeans. A million irrelevant comments of "there are two kinds of countries, ones that put a man on the moon and ones that didn't" can stand in testament to that

I felt there was a comment like OPs before I opened the discussion. Only thing I'm left wondering is which country OP is from. Seems like a German thing to say.

These buildings all look pristine in the photos, almost too pristine.

What about native pueblos? Mound builder structures? Grottos? Historians say 'oldest building' but mean 'oldest western building'

Taos Pueblo for instance - built around 1000AD, still occupied. Palace of the Governors in Santa Fe - 1610. Cliff dwellings of the American Southwest - 750AD, should be top of the list in 4 states.

Why does the list cite Mesa Verde in Colorado yet ignores New Mexico's Chaco Canyon, which pre-dates Mesa Verde by 300 years and certainly is much older than Taos Pueblo? There are also Anasazi sites in Arizona as well that aren't quite as old as Chaco but, none-the-less, are older than the mission they list. Further, Utah has thousands of Anasazi sites from granaries to whole villages that date to the 12th and 13th century. Why didn't they make the cut? If the criteria is that the building must be intact, then Mesa Verde shouldn't be there given that it has been heavily restored from how it appeared when first discovered by Wetherill in the late 19th century.

If you read the article, you'll see that the pueblos are mentioned.

Ah! I didn't scroll all the way down. Just took other comments about '1600s' and concluded, most of American History ignored again. It happens a lot.

Look at any New England building claiming to be 'oldest this or that'. Yet New Mexico, Arizona, California have buildings predating them by centuries. Even boring ol Iowa has mounds (thousands originally) constructed in the 1400s.

Whoever did the map really did the list a disservice by putting the South Dakota site on the top. It makes you assume it was the oldest on the list.

It's always amusing to find out what Americans think is old. Most of the buildings around here are mid to late Victorian with the odd Elizabethan dwelling sitting about two feet lower than anywhere else. The church is 900 years old with the present building dating from 1483.

I chuckle when I realise we have public conveniences here in the UK that are older than Canada.

So question. I always see statements like this online. And I sometimes wonder what is the point. Like it's a colony. The oldest structure are from societies that are all but dead. What's the value of statements like that?

People can't seem to help it. Much the same as when people go abroad and compare everything unfavorably to their home country. Seems like it's reflexive.

Bragging.

"The difference between America and England is that Americans think 100 years is a long time, while the English think 100 miles is a long way." --Earle Hitchner

The UK has always had the advantage of being an island protected from the wars that periodically sweep through mainland areas. There are plenty of cities that I have seen Europe that, due to post-WWII reconstruction, make New York and Chicago seem positively old and historic.

Tectonically stable as well. On the other side there is Japan where there is very little old at all - the earthquakes and landslides see to that. It's a big problem. All anybody wants to do in England is buy and prop up some ancient building. It's hardly surprising we have an energy usage crisis. Everything ends up set in aspic.

It's always amusing when non Americans have to chime in with examples of all of their older things. As if it invalidates anything that's newer. This is an article about the oldest buildings in the states. Which means it's old for the Americans. We get it, you have older stuff, and your infrastructure is generally poorly laid out because of it. Congratulations!

PS. 200km is apparently a "long way" for most Europeans. I find that amusing.

The oldest building in this list is from 1190. Almost 300 years older than your example.

Oh Neil. You silly goose.

I'm glad the fact your structures are older than others brings such delight to your day.

"A person from the United States of America thinks something 100 years old is old. A person from the UK thinks 100 miles is a long way away"

Does your superiority complex help you sleep better at night?

> It's always amusing to find out what Americans think is old.

It's not that we "think" those buildings are old. They are the oldest. There are no older buildings. Age is relative. If you colonize a pacific island, the oldest building will be 1 year old. That doesn't mean the colonizers think 1 year is a long time.

If you want to get into a manhood measuring contest we could broaden the criteria to include native american structures.

If you want to get into a manhood measuring contest we could broaden the criteria to include native american structures.

I don't want to get in to a content, but I am interested in how old they are. The oldest structure here in the UK is a neolithic dwelling dated to ~3700 BC. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knap_of_Howar

The Americas have the likes of Watson Brake and Sechin Bajo, dated to roughly the same time as that, give or take a couple of centuries.

* https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17678841

Well, there is Sechin Bajo from around 3,500 BC, though we know there were people in the Americas at least 8000 years before that, unfortunately their structures haven't survived (that we have found).

Taos Pueblo is on here, there aren't a lot of standing Amerindian structures from that period.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com