I never really believed that, but I also never bothered to figure out it's actual signification. Thanks for posting this.
Various Christian church segments, including ones related to protestantism, were pro-peace/anti-war/anti-violence such as the Quakers in the USA [1] See also the Wikipedia entry peace churches [2].
I happen to know the peace movement in The Netherlands (with Nijmegen being an important center) was entwined with the hippie movement, and consisted of religious Christians. Not solely though.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peace_movement#Historic_peace_...
All I can say, to challenge this proactive lying and deceitfulness, is to demand proof of a historical claim or STFU.
No, that's silly. Witches don't have "rituals to fight Christians," excepting the fringe sort of bigots that can be found in every religion. This is a stereotype that derives from medieval Christian ideology as informed by modern right-wing Evangelical paranoia, whereby all so-called "pagan" religions are assumed to be explicitly Satanic.
Maybe take a minute on Google and try to find out what practitioners of other religions believe about themselves, rather than what their enemies believe about them.
Unless you know each and every witch personally, how can you know what rituals they engage in?
What I would be interested in is to find out about Wiccan/Neo-Pagan believes regarding the peace symbols.
> Maybe take a minute on Google and try to find out what practitioners of other religions believe about themselves, rather than what their enemies believe about them.
You seem to imply I am a "modern right-wing Evangelical"?
Maybe you could spare me your aggressions against these and stop being condescending towards me and instead help me out with the subject matter at hand? You seem to be knowledgeable about these things (maybe).
>What I would be interested in is to find out about Wiccan/Neo-Pagan believes regarding the peace symbols
So, do you or don't you want know what neopagans think? On one side, you disregard all anecdotes. The other side, you want to know said anecdotes.
I'm beginning to think this an insincere request. I know very few whom would answer that kind of question.
Tl;Dr. Go look up occult books on symbolism. There's a lot of them. Perhaps that would be more up your alley.
I'd really like to know IF these anti-christianity rituals I've heard of are OLDER than the peace sign as anti-nuclear power symbol or not. IF they even exist.
I do not find neither Wiccans nor Evangelicals overly trustworthy on that account.
(I was hoping for a good link or two. Usually you get some good ones in the HN discussions, if you open your mouth.)
What I have heard is that Witches who would turn over to that faith from Christianity would have to undergo a ritual denouncing their former faith. Part of that ritual (or a subgroup of them, I guess), would be a transformation of a (Christian) cross in a circle into a peace sign, by turning the cross upside down and then breaking the cross beams such as to form the peace sign.
If this really happens, I would like to know deeper Wiccan meanings about it. Is it related to "peace"? How old are these customs? etc
Historically, Gardner was looking at creating a naturalistic Thelema. A lot of whoopie witches glomed onto that and turned it into crystal toting fairies kind of religion.
I know of the Gnostic Mass from Thelema, but again, theres nothing like what you're describing. Similar, with the Golden Dawn, or Theosophy, or Enochian magic - There's nothing like what you describe.
You do say "witches" which I will assume European magical tradition. My first reaction is that what you say is akin to "telephone game" and stories so convoluted that its just a horror story.
I can ask some of my sources whom know more, but this doesn't sound like a credible story.
I can see that a dealing with a now unwelcome Christian past is a theme in Wicca, because it is a Western movement. Therefor most practitioners would have a Western past in one way or another.
If it is not too costly for you and you can find something out, I would be thankful. Maybe even only a comparison with other existing Wiccan rituals to deal with the past.
Plenty of people turn from Christianity to paganism, it's actually a popular way for edgy Christian kids to rebel, particularly in the American south where there's a particular stigma against "devil stuff." I know a few such people, and I've never heard of anyone having to do any rituals to "renounce" their faith, nor have I ever heard of the "peace sign as broken cross" being used as a symbol in any ritual.
But then, as you doubt sources from Wiccans, so I don't know what else to tell you. These religions aren't hiding anything, there's an entire section of pagan and neopagan books at any bookstore, you can do research online, or probably find some pagans near you and talk to them. They'll tell you the same thing I'm telling you.
In fact, I'll help you out... start here: http://witchvox.com/
That aside, I disagree with your statement that these religions don't hide anything. Christians, Freemasons, Wiccans and others all have their secrets, their mysterion. Nothing wrong with that, if you ask me.
Wicca and Paganaism was never about "anti-christian". The christians would have you believe that anything not theirs is 'of the devil'. That's brainless propaganda intent to denigrate other religions. If anything, christians took significant content from the old practices and incorporated it into their own practice.
Fast forward 2000 years into the 1960's. Anton Szander LaVey created a anti-christian religion which follows the christian bible, but makes opposite choices. Edgy and all that. And yes, the ritual you describe is found here.
(I didn't see this comment before I replied to your other one.)
>Unless you know each and every witch personally, how can you know what rituals they engage in?
"I've heard that Witches use the peace sign in their rituals to fight Christians" seems to imply that such a ritual would be a common occurrence, which is what I was addressing.
>You seem to imply I am a "modern right-wing Evangelical"?
No, I just thought you picked something up from them. To be perfectly honest, I assumed it was something created to disparage the anti-war/hippie movement (linking the peace symbol, and by extension, the peace movement, to something unwholesome by implying the symbol has a secret anti-Christian meaning) and just got transferred to beliefs about Wiccans/witches somehow.
But apparently it is a Satanist ritual, so my (partial) mistake.
>Maybe you could spare me your aggressions against these and stop being condescending towards me and instead help me out with the subject matter at hand?
I didn't mean to be aggressive... but this was literally something you could solve with a Google search.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken#In_religion_and_mythol...