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Comment by mnm1 | Hacker News Reader

Chargeback. Chargeback. Chargeback. That's unfortunately the new strategy that I've been using more and more these last couple of years to deal with crooked companies like Uber, Amazon, as well as local businesses like car repair and ticket vending. It's just unbelievable how little protection consumers have. And of course, even chargebacks don't always work. Then it's over to small claims court. This has also been increasing because we simply don't have proper consumer protection laws and have no other alternatives to companies literally stealing our money. It's just a fact of life in America that you will be fucked over and over by companies stealing money with little recourse. This isn't even uber's only scam. Drivers often don't even try to come and when you cancel the ride, they charge you for the driver's incompetence. Chargeback again and again and again then small claims. If only we could have proper laws regulating such fraud...

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I don't see why that's unfortunate. It was the route taken here, too:

> Despite several email exchanges, Uber never agreed to reimburse her the extra money. But she disputed the charge with her credit card company and got back her $98. Uber then canceled her account.

Problem solved.

> If neither Uber nor the credit card issuers agree to reimburse the victims of fraud in Miami, it’s not clear if the dispute becomes an issue for the county or the state.

But I didn't read any evidence that a credit card issuer has denied the customer's dispute. In fact every (reasonable) case I've ever heard of the card issuer sides with the cardholder and not the merchant.

Unfortunately i have had the opposite experience and the card company sided with the merchant.

When you issue a chargeback, the credit card company asks the merchant to return the money. They have no power to enforce this even if they side with the issuer. If they cannot get the money after six months or so, you're on your own with small claims. I'm there right now even though the merchant promised in writing they would refund me. I've been screwed before also with five star Marriott hotel rooms that had no air conditioning in summer in Cancun. The belief that the credit card company eats the loss if the merchant refuses to refund is a myth, albeit one even I believed till recently. Don't ever rely on that. Not from any credit card, not even Amex. This is how things really work and most people don't find out till they get fucked over.

That's how in the article one of the victims got her money back.

> But she disputed the charge with her credit card company and got back her $98. Uber then canceled her account.

The problem is then Uber canceled her account. So they assumed she was the one being fraudulent.

I guess she can try Lyft from now on, but then the same fraud could happen there and she'd be locked out of that app as well. Then back to taxis? Which may or may not be bad, as I noticed some taxi services started getting better after they were forced to compete with these ride sharing companies.

> The problem is then Uber canceled her account. So they assumed she was the one being fraudulent.

Why would a customer want to continue using a service whose driver fraudulently accused them of damaging property?

> I guess she can try Lyft from now on, but then the same fraud could happen there and she'd be locked out of that app as well. Then back to taxis? Which may or may not be bad, as I noticed some taxi services started getting better after they were forced to compete with these ride sharing companies.

The uncontroversial answer to your question is yes. If you find that Uber, Lyft, Yellow Cab, and every reasonable form of available public transportation have drivers who are all uniformly running scams and refuse you service upon CC disputes, you've probably got much bigger problems to worry about in this country.

edit: typo

> Why would a customer want to continue using a service whose driver fraudulently accused them of damaging property?

Because Uber is an effective monopoly in certain markets given the convenience factor. It's why people still use their crappy internet provider or utility company.

Or she can sign up for a new email and new uber/lyft account. I doubt they care and probably leave this door open like Amazon because they know they will fuck people over wrongfully.

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