On the other, it's absolutely hilarious given the history of this community. Those of us with Linux-running Thinkpads remain ready to receive you guys. Seriously: it's pretty nice over here.
Personally I run a 2017 MBP for work and a heavily modified T430 running Debian at home. I often miss my personal hardware throughout the workday - having USB ports, ethernet, different display ports, and swappable batteries is invaluable. The OS differences are huge too - OSX is just not my cup-o-tea when it comes to package managers (brew sucks vs. aptitude), running a development environment, and even just running simple *nix binaries (there are significant differences with the OSX versions).
I know that some things may "just work" on the Apple ecosystem, but don't forget that you are paying a lot of money to get that ecosystem working and from all the complaining I'm reading It doesn't seem like a totally smooth experience at all.
edit: words, format.
Meanwhile my 2011 MBA (w/ a cheap replaceable battery) lasted 7 years before I sold it on to someone else, still in working order.
Between the two anecdotes above is a huge difference.
What I'll probably do is wait til the rest of the fall lineup is announced, including the rumored "MBA replacement", to see what the prices are before buying one. Then I'll just use my current MB as backup.
https://support.apple.com/mac/repair/service
It's pricy, for sure, but I assume that also includes the cost of a new OEM battery which usually isn't especially cheap.
I'm seriously considering buying a Windows laptop for the first time in almost a decade.
They run Linux well if you want that *nix goodness.
Personally I have been very happy with the touchpad on my Thinkpad with the libinput drivers under Wayland.
I can highly recommend Surface. W10 + WSL beats OSX + VirtualBox handily for dev work. Great keyboard, great screen too.
1. I just mailed it in for the keyboard replacement yesterday.
2. I was slightly disappointed at the time that they didn't include a USB-C to Lightning cable for the iPhone 7, but it made sense as the iPhone 7 was released earlier. The fact that the iPhone X doesn't include that cable is inexcusable.
3. It's weird that there's an audio jack but my iPhone comes with lightning headphones. Not much of an issue in practice though as never really use either for audio, and AirPods work well on both devices.
So my issues with the MBP are mostly related to how it ties in to the broader Apple line-up, and the lack of out-of-the-box compatibility/connectivity between devices.
USB-C, and particularly Thunderbolt 3, is awesome though:
* Sure, the power brick doesn't have ears, but you can just remove the cable from the adapter. Seems like a better solution to me. The ears are no longer necessary because the cable isn't attached to it.
* The power brick can be used to quickly charge your iPhone or other USB-C PD devices. For instance, I also use it to charge a USB-C PD battery pack, which I can then use to charge my MBP at 30W on the go.
* I never have adapters dangling from my laptop. I've bought a few new cables, a USB-C display that charges my laptop over a single cable, and a USB-C SSD that's more compatible (e.g. not Thunderbolt 2) and faster than I could previously achieve.
* I'm contemplating getting a Thunderbolt 3 NVMe SSD and an eGPU soon. Both will provide near-desktop performance extremely conveniently albeit at the expense of backward compatibility.
* Touch ID makes it much easier for me to keep my computer safe. I can conveniently separate more activities with user accounts and use longer passwords, and I don't have to worry if someone or a camera is peeking while doing so.
* The few times I've had to use HDMI I've plugged in the HDMI cable, which now has a USB-C adapter permanently attached. Problem solved.
Yeah, first by not releasing "MBPs with 32GB RAM" and then by releasing them.
They can never get a chance...
>USB C only means I always have a bunch of adapters dangling from my laptop
Or, you know, just buy USB-C to whatever cables and be done with it. It's like a $50 investment for a $2000+ laptop, if having an adapter is so much of a problem.
I have USB-C to A, USB-C to that bizarro USB B BS 2.5 external hard disks have, USB-C to lighting, and USB-C to HDMI. End of story, no adapters to carry. YMMV.
Or you can get just the USB-C to female HDMI alone, and a standard HDMI cable for your monitor. You aren't going to be carrying HDMI cables around anyway.
which is called an adapter
(edit to fit terminology in this thread)
Or they can leave an adapter at the office, along with the projector's cable, and everyone can get to use it.
The complain was about being "full of adapters", not about having to use a single adapter under specific requirements...
My $2000/$3000 laptop needs a $30 adapter to connect to a projector is as "first world's problems" as they come.
If it's the latter, the argument is moot vs USB-C, and if it's the former I just personally don't miss the HDMI port in earlier MBPs. Mostly because I would have to use a Mini DisplayPort to HDMI to get 4K@60Hz - the HDMI port in the latest pre USB-C Macbook Pro only support 4K@30hz.
The situation with display connectors is particularly sad even without USB-C, as we went quickly from still largely VGA and maybe DVI a few years ago to HDMI/DP/mini-DP co-existing, and now USB-C in the mix. I just recently had to buy a USB-C to DP cable even though my work laptop has HDMI and I've been using it fine, becaues this particular monitor does not support anything bigger than 1920x1080@60 over HDMI, and DP is only offered via USB-C on the laptop side. How often do you see this particular combination being required a year ago? But here we are, dealing with a quasi-N^2 problem.
It's enough that one of them is a female HDMI.
If an employer buys USB-C only laptops for employees I'd consider it very likely, not to mention smart, if there was a USB-C plug in the bundle.
I understand, but don't share, your bitterness over USB-C as a display interface, particularly since you can use it for so many other things even when it's obsolete for that purpose.
In the context we're debating (e.g. compatibility/convenience problems related to recent MBPs) it's also much simpler than the scenario you're portraying. In that case, the other end of the connection is the only variable as there's only one connector type, but fortunately USB-C/TB3 supports all the others :)
And that what people don't like is "dongle" and "multi-port" style adapters, not mere adapter cables that go from one form to another.
I'm pretty sure that disliking dongles and multi-port style adapters does not preclude disliking cables that serve as adapters (either as an additional dislike or as a replacement dislike).
There are plenty of comments here that imply that the primary objection for some people isn't the form of the adapter, but, rather, the need to carry anything additional/custom[1].
I do agree that your point that some of the cables-cum-adapters are not, in fact, additional, because they merely replace what used to be a standard cable (e.g. the one that "came with my phone") is being glossed over.
However, that only addresses the "additional" part of the complaint, not the "custom" part, which has to do with availability/ubiquity. It's not just that the aforementioned standard phone charging cable used to be carried already, but it's also the same cable that came with every other phone, which means that, if the user forgets it, it's very easy to replace (or even just borrow a replacement), often even with a choice of lengths at not even specialty-electronics stores. Lose or forget your custom adapter-cable, and you could be out of luck until that store opens, if there even is one in town.
[1] For lack of a better term. I realize USB-C is also a standard, so "less standard" isn't quite right, but "less widely accepted standardizationly" is too wordy and awkward, so please bear with my shoehorning in of this word.
I agree with most everything you said, but unless you're surrounded by nothing but MBP's these cables are not replacements; they are additional nonsense.
For the "road warrior" use case, one cannot, in general, assume that it will be possible to unplug an arbitrary cable (especially not within a reasonable amount of time), no.
Even assuming one could just unplug that cable, there's no guaranteeing that the substitute cable is long enough.
I've seen a remarkable variety of conference room cabling setups, and, though it speaks to the ingenuity of (especially startup) companies adapting to various facilities constraints, it also means that there are no safe assumptions one can make a priori about availability of connectors, including gender thereof.
We probably could have a better setup, but we don't.
Of course, if you look back in the past by only a few years, you would have been in a time where none of those adapters were even necessary with a MacBook Pro. And there are other models of computer (of comparable capabilities) where they're not even necessary today.
It's also probably good that you don't try and carry a USB-C to USB-C cable, since it would probably be out of spec for some use of USB-C.
People don't like to carry adapters in the form of "dongles" -- not mere adapters that are just cable sized.
The argument was against the extra bulk over cables, not against any added circuitry (not to mention that USB itself, whether A, B, or C, has circuitry anyway).
You listed the four adapters you have, then said "no adapters". :) Just because the adapter is more than 3" long doesn't make it something else. You still have to buy it separately and carry it with you. When a machine has more than just one kind of port, you're freed up to use whatever standard cable is already connected to the projector, or came with the hard disk, or was included with your phone.
Otherwise the USB-C to A + USB-C to HDMI is one adapter if you get Apple's version. So maximum one adapter is required here.
For my external audio interface (I do computer music).
It's also common in MIDI controller keyboards -- USB from the computer to USB B on the keyboard (though I have mine setup with BT MIDI).
But also many printers use one, especially older ones.
With my 2012 MBP, I don't need to buy extra cables for each device I have. I just use the standard cable that's included. Or the one that the conference room already has. HDMI for displays (or DP), USB for a keyboard or mouse, etc.
When all you have is the USB-C port, it's now your own responsibility to carry a cable for each situation.
Don't get me wrong. I don't think it's all that big of a deal. But I understand where complainers are coming from.
For those type of "foreign environment" (e.g. not your house or office) where you don't know what you'll meet, a single USB-C to HDMI and USB 3.0 adapter, which weights next to nothing, and is sold by Apple and many third parties (down to $10-$20) will do.
https://www.amazon.com/Pass-Through-Multiport-Supports-Throu...
I think the frustration dongle-haters feel is that Apple puts so much effort into slimming down their laptops, only to ruin it with the need to pack extra stuff. If the computer was just a few mm thicker, it would have better battery life, room for some USB-A ports, HDMI port, etc. And the backpack wouldn't need to have the dongle or extra cables in there.
Again, this is mostly academic for me. The only dongle I've ever had to use is a TB-to-GigEth one. But I was pissed the one time I forgot it and became the only person in the room unable to get on the network. Wi-Fi is way more common now, so that's not a hazard. But the other ports (USB-A, HDMI, etc.) are still in wide use, whereas USB-C is still a mishmash of incompatible cables, protocols, and connector types.
A few years from now, this whole argument will probably (hopefully) be looked at the same way the floppy drive's abandonment was in 1997.
No, I listed 3 cables. No adapters. E.g. I had 3-4 external hard disks with the "micro USB to USB" style cable (1). I bought micro-USB to USB-C. No adapter needed (if there's any circuity inside the cable, it was there in the micro-USB to USB cable too, which is even more bulky).
Similar, I sometimes connect to an external audio interface, which has a USB B type cable (2). I bought a USB B to USB-C and am done.
Finally, I had a HDMI to HDMI cable on my old MBP. I went out and bought a USB-C to HDMI cable and just use that.
I don't need a dongle or multi-port adapter to plug the old cables in. I just replaced the old cables.
(1) https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81w%2By3Rwq...
(2) https://www.lifewire.com/thmb/a2KtBcVnreIJ_5hunhd6Ul9UOng=/7...
My 2014 13" retina MBP can plug 2 USB devices 2 Thunderbolt devices a HDMI screen and power
If I go all USB-C my 2017 13" can plug screen and power anything more and I need to use dongles and from what I see looking around the offices I visit, most people end up using dongles.
MBPs have been USB-C only for years now and a dongle free future is still nowhere in sight, I'm starting to feel USB-C is going to be forever a dongle port.