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Comment by outime | Hacker News Reader

As a Helsinki resident (and Whim user) it’s important to point out that while the user base of Whim has grown quite a bit, it’s most likely due to the introductory price that won’t last forever. For 49 € you get public transport, public bike (first half an hour free), cheap taxi rides and perhaps slightly cheaper car renting, whereas to get public transport alone without this app is around 55 €. So I wouldn’t call it a success just yet.

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As a another Helsinki resident, I agree. Whim is nice experiment but not necessarily a solution with their current business model.

I think that Whim (or another Whim type service) can work if you consider the the price of the parking space.

Currently Helsinki has zoning regulations for mandatory parking places that is too high (roughly 0.8 per apartment). The cost of parking place is something like 30,000 - 70,000 euros or more. Assuming that return of capital is 8%, the cost of parking space is 100 - 400 euros per month.

If the mandatory zoning requirement is dropped, Whim style services can become profitable even in the long term.

That is a remarkable cost for a structured parking space! In America the construction cost is like $20-30k (17-25k EUR). I bet you could find projects for more than that but nothing like 70k EUR.

They can go up to $130k, but that's due to supply and demand, not construction costs.

If parking space is build underground as it often is in the cities, the construction is expensive. If you build below sea level, it can be even more.

If you build above the ground, the construction cost can be just $20-30k EUR, but after you factor in the cost of the land, the cost is similar.

It's noted in the article that once they reach 60k subscribing monthly users they can start buying wholesale from the transportation markets which will allow them to turn a profit.

I understand the model, but nevertheless Whim points out it’s an introductory offer, so price raise is expected.

They are probably running at big loss. As per the contract, resellers have to pay the retail price 2.20€ per ticket. So they start running at a loss after around 22 tickets per month. And that's just for the public transportation.

The 55€/month is only for Helsinki area residents and subsidized from municipal taxes. Without the subsidy it's over 130€/month.

It’s interesting how many areas of life are moving from tax-subsidized to VC subsidized. Not complaining, I’m happy to take their money.

It may well turn out to be taxpayer subsidized too, but with additional financial crisis and bailout steps.

Does it cover the greater Helsinki area? As a Vantaa resident, I spend over 100 euros a month on public transport. This app sounds too good to be true. What's the catch?

Yes it does (internal Vantaa) although I don’t recall if city bikes have arrived there yet (unlike Espoo). For cross-region tickets (Helsinki + Vantaa for instance) you need to pay around 100 € with the app.

I contacted them at launch to ask about the price. They didn’t even mention publicly that it was an introductory offer at the time. They replied to me prices will go up eventually so I’m expecting it any day now.

HSL are also working on a monthly API I believe so I suspect the hassle of having to buy a ticket each time through Whim will soon disappear.

The car rental is not particularly cheap. Have you had any experience with that yet?

Can you elaborate on what constitutes a "cheap taxi ride"? Is this a flat percentage discount off the regular fare? Something else?

“Cheap” by finnish standards - means you pay a maximum of 10 € for a 5 km radius trip.

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