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Comment by furyg3 | Hacker News Reader

Especially in cases when it doesn't need to be thinner. I just tried out a Apple Magic Keyboard, which is a razor blade for some reason, and had wrist pain within a few hours of using it. Everybody's different, but this keyboard is trash. It is designed solely to look pretty in marketing photos.

I'm not a keyboard snob. I don't need Cherry MX Blue's to be happy. I thought the Apple Wireless Keyboard (with the AA batteries) was probably a step in the wrong direction, but still fine to type on. But this is quite literally painfully bad. And there was no reason for it, it's not a portable product, it doesn't have heat sinks, screens, fast processors, etc. It's just a keyboard, it would be fine if it's 2mm thicker. Actually it would be better.

It's a keyboard. It's for typing. Come on.

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I am currently using this horrible keyboard. Hate this thing. Before I've been using a mechanical keyboard, but coworkers complained that it was too loud. I like loud keybords. The sound is so pleasant and satisfying I want it to be even more intense. I want to feel vibration every time I hit the key. And when I hit enter I want there to be a minor earthquake.

This apple trash keyboard doesn't have Shift+Insert. The alt is next to ctrl and it's place is taken by cmd. I had to change my bindings for i3. Caps lock isn't solid and instead of caps + f, I oftentimes type simply f, because caps is released too soon. (caps is rebinded to ctrl and caps + f means select suggested autocompletion). Enter is small.

Actually, I will apply for new keyboard this very day, right now. It will be regular mashed potatoes keyboard, but it's still going to be better than this.

The Microsoft Sculpt Ergonomic Keyboard does not have loud switches, but feels much better than the Magic Keyboard. Only the function keys are not great.

+1 for the sculpt ergonomic, the older black version (with external numpad) and newer surface version are both great.

The newer surface version is mostly better because it has an Fn key instead of a physical switch to go between media keys and F1, F2, etc.. plus real home/insert/end/arrow keys. I do wish they left the numberpad separate though, as it increase the distance to my mouse/trackpad and I preferred to just get rid of it, as personally I never use it. But many people also like to have it...

Newer version is also bluetooth which is great on mac, but less great on windows/linux as you don't get bootloader support.

The ergonomic/natural/arc keyboards are, by far, the best products Microsoft ever sold. I do love the Apple trackpads, however. There is no better way to work on a Mac.

As for my Linuxing, I have a Unicomp "Battleship" (PC122 keyboard) that's loud as hell, but has the best feel since the beam spring keyboards God added to the IBM 3270's when it made them in the 6th day.

I'm still rockin' the original Microsoft Natural on my workstation. My current motherboard has a PS2 keyboard connector, but I have a USB-PS2 adapter if/when the day comes to upgrade.

I originally bought three of them, and two are still working good.

I also recently bought one of the new Microsoft keyboards, and the feel on it is still pretty good.

Trackball is way better than any trackpad for me. I have three Microsoft Ergonomic keyboards. Two of the Surface ones and one of their cheaper ones which is about $20 at a BestBuy.

My favorite combo is similar - Microsoft Ergonomic Sculpt & Logitech M570 "thumball" trackball mouse.

The thing with the trackpad on Macs is the gesture thing. Swiping desktops, zooming out on all windows, the "3D" click... The fluid way it allows me to work is priceless.

I use its forerunner the Ergo 4000, nice to type on, quiet, full keyboard and works out the box with its media keys on Linux.

Ironic that I use a Microsoft keyboard to type code in a Microsoft language in a Microsoft editor on Linux.

The world is a strange place.

Microsoft has released consistently good hardware for over 20 years now. There have been a few duds over the years but by and large their input devices have been stellar.

+1, the sculpt keyboard and even mouse are my daily drivers at both desks and very well priced.

After a quick key remap on MacOS and a bit of muscle memory adjustment on finger placement that was well with it, my typing speed hasn't suffered and hands are happy. I do wish MS made Mac drivers. No Mac keyboard can hold a candle to this kbd.

I tried the my much more expensive kinesis freestyle with the trimmings - it was nice but too slow to type on because of the keys.

The dream keyboard would be a MS sculpt cut in half like a kinesis freestyle 3, maybe with apple keys that work, and wireless halves.

I have used http://matias.ca/quietpro/ in an office environment.

It feels 90% as good as a clicky keyboard and the colleagues I've asked about it don't mind the little noise it does put out.

Counter-point, I haven't had a single Apple keyboard fail on me yet (although I do not own the new Macbook, so I don't have the dreadful one) and my Matias broke after just 1 year.

Matias talks a good game, but we bought 30 of their keyboards and they didn’t last very long. We had much better luck with Logitech. Also, we are batting a 1000 on broken butterfly keyboards. It is really disappointing and frankly the feel of the things is awful.

Worrying! I've had two (one at home, one at work) over the last 3 years. What were the failure modes?

Matias? Keys just stopped working. We cleaned them (we have people who are trained techs) and they still just stopped working. Two of the keyboards just stopped working for everything. It was weird. Plus they were really cheapish build quality.

MacBook Pro - the B key is dead on each keyboard.

>This apple trash keyboard doesn't have Shift+Insert. The alt is next to ctrl and it's place is taken by cmd. I had to change my bindings for i3.

Not how you didn't described anything being actually "crap" -- just different to what you were used to.

Here's a product for you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nzjr3kCbJqc

Not crap, just different.

Still no argument.

shrug

Using a custom order WASD keyboard on the workstation and butterfly v2. on an MB. Can't say one is worse than another. The worst thing about Apple's keyboard is botched up layout, rather than any haptics problem.

(Also, it's a huge improvement over the old-style far-apart, mushy blocky Apple keys).

Get a metal base keyboard with MX browns or clears. That'll have the tactile feel, but a fraction of the sound.

> This apple trash keyboard doesn't have Shift+Insert. The alt is next to ctrl and it's place is taken by cmd.

Macs have had a different keyboard layout to PCs for decades. The keyboard you describe is what Mac users expect.

>Especially in cases when it doesn't need to be thinner. I just tried out a Apple Magic Keyboard, which is a razor blade for some reason, and had wrist pain within a few hours of using it. Everybody's different, but this keyboard is trash. It is designed solely to look pretty in marketing photos.

If you're talking about the keyboard on the new MacBook Pros, yes, it's trash.

If you're talking about the standalone keyboard actually called "Magic Keyboard", then I disagree, it's perfectly done, and a pleasure to type on.

And I own several mechanical keyboards (and have started as back as to be using Sun's own keyboards on Spark workstations).

Is he's talking about this thing?

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/611149H28WL...

Because I absolutely love it, been coding on it for years.

No, he's talking about it's replacement.

That keyboard was good. It's replacement is worse, but only moderately worse, so it's got less attention than the train wreck that is the Macbook and Macbook Pro keyboards.

I would assume he is talking about the Magic Keyboard 2.0 which is the newer version of that one. It is widely considered to be an excellent keyboard and many people (rightly in my opinion) don’t understand why they just don’t put that keyboard in their laptops. I type on the MK2.0 and love it but keyboards are a personal thing and there any many thin style ones that I just can’t type on, and don’t get me started on “mechanical” keyboards, awful, loud, dreadful RSI inducing things (for me).

He's talking about the second version, but everything he said still applies to this (in the way he thinks it).

I have borrowed one from a colleague, because I like to swap keyboards every now and then for variation and the old Apple Wireless Keyboards were ok. I also had wrist pain within hours with the Magic Keyboard. This is a huge difference compared to the unassuming Microsoft Sculp Ergonomic Keyboard, which is not only cheaper but really feels nice in comparison. It also has genuinely useful features such as reverse tilt, a magnetic battery door, a split, and wide spacebars. Plus it has full-size arrow keys (though I don't use them much, because vim/evil).

Short-travel keyboards are, by some studies, less likely to cause RSI than typewriter-style longer-travel keyboards. At the very least, there is reason to question why emulating the key travel of a mechanical typewriter linkage makes sense versus short travel, or even no-travel haptic feedback.

I think Apple's keyboards, when they work, work really well. And you can get them without number pads so your hand isn't traversing a wasteland of wasted keys to get to the mouse.

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