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Comment by mbfg | Hacker News Reader

Udell said that these results agreed with previous studies that have shown that dogs are not as good at independent problem-solving as wolves, and that they get more distracted by social stimulation.

I'm not sure that's true. I think dogs have fantastic problem solving skills. The solutions, however, are typically to use the human to solve their problems.

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Yes, I've observed this behavior as well. If they come across a problem they know they can't solve (i.e. rat in a tree), they come ask you if you have any ideas.

This isn't limited to domestic animals, though. Ravens, upon finding a corpse of an large animal that they can't break the hide to get to the delicious meat, will make a racket to attract predators. Hearing the noise a wolf, coyote, bear, or bobcat comes along opens the dead animal, has a nice meal, and the ravens get the leftovers. That's ravens for you, using their own predators as tools.

So... did you have any ideas about the rat?

Crows will pack hunt rats. I didn’t know they did this until I watched it happen this year. One would peck at it from behind; the rat would squeak and whip around; next crow would hop in and peck it from behind. Rinse, spin, repeat a few times and in 5 minutes or so they were picking meat off the rat.

All I could think watching this, was that I was watching a literal murder of crows.

I saw a group of 3 or 4 seagulls take down a pigeon in this way on an office rooftop next door.

It was too gruesome to watch. When I next looked out there was just a wing with a few feathers hanging off it sitting there.

I've moved from waving the nearest $long_yard_tool randomly to a pellet gun, which has proved to be pretty humane. Something about having an orange tree next to a neighbor's avocado tree really attracts the rats.

Corvidae are smart as hell. I think they're one of the most clever animals around. I'm not sure when or why I started, but I have fed (American) crows for years wherever I live. At my current place, I have been feeding a particular crow (and his mother) as long as he's been alive. I specifically remember his mother setting up shop in the palm tree across the street when she had this particular crow. Anyway, he follows me when I leave the house. This crow literally follows me to the grocery store, or when I go for my run, or to the convenience store. His mother doesn't, though. I have tried to take him in by leaving my lanai door open, but that is just one barrier the crows around here never seem to overcome. I've let other crows into my house before, but the crows in this neighborhood clearly think it is a deadly proposition. I don't know how weird any of this is, but it's just something I've always done.

My grandma feeds wild (hooded) crows and seagulls. She claims to know all of them by name, she even claims they have preferred food (like bread, sausage etc...) and she seems to have a very strong emotional connection with them. Whenever we go to any sort of trip that makes her away from home for a few days, she invariably starts talking about her crows and seagulls, complaining she wasn't able to feed them.

What kind of food do they like? I also want to do that. I look at and whistle with the birds in my town for quite a while, but I am not sure what would be good food to carry around for them.

Crows go apeshit for plain peanuts and granola bars that I've kinda crushed up or broken into pieces which seem reasonably-sized for them to eat. Usually that means I break a peanut of "average" size into four pieces. Once along that natural split, and then each piece once more. Other birds really like that stuff, too, and whatever the crows don't eat, the smaller ones do. There's always nothing left, perhaps obviously.

There fact that they can't solve problems without us is why we can leave them alone in our houses. Can you imagine a dog with great problem solving skills in your house all day?

I'm not sure what you mean, could you elaborate? Do you mean they might be able to figure out how to steal the meat in the freezer, escape, play with the printer machine etc...

My dog:

• Successfully swiped a (new!) jar of peanut butter from a high up rack in the kitchen without breaking anything

• Broke two small holes through the plastic lid with her incisors

• Unscrewed the lid(!)

• Licked the entire thing empty

RIP my German Shepherd Afghan Hound Mix.

If I had the money, spacetime & resources for it, I'd try to breed some hybrids from Shiba Inu, New Guinea singing dogs (assuming I could do so without endangering the population), Basenji, Huskies, Ibizan Hounds, Border Collies, and a bunch of other breeds, to try to find a new breed with extremely wideband vocalization abilities, few genetic health issues, and very high intelligence. (Haven't found a breed with novel hips yet, however. Most videos one sees of dogs walking upright involve extremely cruel training methods to force the animal into an unnatural behavior which damages their hips - not something one'd want.)

Did you know? Humans have two mutations in the FOXP2 gene affecting the protein structure, one of which dogs also have (not the one famed for causing a change in language skills however. But even so, that seems interesting.)

A canine geneticist and an expert in animal behavior showed this to be the case and their research agrees with previous studies, but because you happen to think otherwise, it must not be true.

Maybe I'm missing something and you can help me out, but I really don't understand this sort of thinking.

I believe you’ve missed the sarcasm and humour in the way the above comment was phrased. :)

That's entirely possible! Apologies if that is the case.

You could start by addressing his point and not appealing to "experts."

"Independent" problem-solving.

what does independent mean, tho? If you consider the human just a tool, then the dog is solving it independently.

The issue of the word "tool" having been used in reference to you in particular not withstanding, it's pretty well understood that collaboration is not tool-using.

In an interdependent universe, every problem is solved independently - by the universe.

In this case, independent means without human help.

Cats also do that, only to a greater extent: "Meow! I got stuck in a tree, call the fire brigade."

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