Hacker News Reader

Comment by jmagoon | Hacker News Reader

The other good thing about this is that the Pixelbook is a 3:2 screen, so finally there's a laptop with a proper display resolution that can run Linux nicely.

There's a good community of folks over at https://www.reddit.com/r/Crostini/ who have been tinkering with this for quite some time.

View on HN

Why is 3:2 better than standard 16:9?

It depends on what you do. 16:9 is better for wathing 16:9 movies. But if you read lots of text, narrower, longer columns are usually a lot more handy. We have way more vertical than horizontal scrollbars.

I prefer 16:9 or 16:10 because I have a lot of windows side-by-side most of the time. I don't have 1 file open while coding, most of the time 2 or 3, in that case a wider screen is better in my opinion.

I've got a surface and in my opinion 3:2 is actually better for multitasking. You can fit two windows vertically. So you end up having 4 windows side by side.

More vertical space for reading text, including code

Taller, better for coding.

> Why is 3:2 better than standard 16:9?

It's not better. It's usually just people projecting their personal preferences as though they should apply to everyone else.

Every one is different, so as long as the individual is content with what they've got, it doesn't really matter what aspect ratio they're using.

Because 16:9 ("shortscreens") was a ploy by manufacturers to sell a smaller screen for the same diagonal. Combined with much of the vertical dimension being eaten by the general pattern of window decoration + app taskbar + app toolbars + OS taskbar, and well, at least they're good for watching movies!

huawei matebook x is 3:2 and runs linux nicely

surface book appears to as well, but i don't have one of them to vouch for

The Verge makes it sound like the touchpad is basically unusable and battery life is apparently poor.

https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/24/16007692/huawei-matebook-...

This should be better battery life using GNU/Linux. The process the supports the VM runs under ChromeOS.

> with a proper display resolution

3:2? No thanks I don't really want black bars when watching movies...

What I'd really really like is something with the build quality (especially the touchpad!) of a MacBook Pro, with decent and recent hardware, first class Linux support for all features, support for both USB-C and "old" USB and a decent keyboard with it. And that without paying more than for an technologically outdated yet still top-of-the-line MBP...

So a thinkpad.

Give me a Thinkpad with a full aluminium body, a touchpad with a size that's actually usable and we'll talk. Sorry but I have developed a real dislike for small touchpads incapable of reliable gestures and full plastic bodies.

Thinkpads have magnesium chassis (X1 is carbon fiber).

A metal body is heavy, prone to dents and attenuates radio. Why are you so keen on having one? The X1 Carbon is lighter, tougher and more serviceable than a MacBook Pro, in part because of a better choice of materials.

As for trackpads, Apple keep making them larger and larger, so a ThinkPad trackpad is no smaller than a MacBook from a few years ago. The keyboard is surely the primary concern.

The trackpad is also terrible compared to modern MacBooks aside from the size. It flexes, feels worse and does not reliably track gestures. The whole thing feels stuck a decade ago.

> The whole thing feels stuck a decade ago.

Says the macOS user... did you even get a newer version of bash yet? I heard even Debian stable has a newer bash version than macOS.

`brew install bash`

Software is trivial to upgrade and that's a very silly comparison to make.

Bash is hardly relevant for actual Apple developers.

There are no missing features that would prevent developing Swift and Objective-C applications.

Sure, because Swift and Objective-C applications is all that matters. /s

This comment alone proves that Apple developers are a bunch of clueless idiots.

No, we just buy Apple hardware for doing Apple related development, not as a replacement for Linux to do Linux development.

If you want to do that buy hardware from Linux vendors like Dell and System76.

You shouldn't buy from Apple, it's bad for your freedom.

https://www.gnu.org/proprietary/malware-apple.html

On a past life, about 20 years ago, I was a FOSS zealot of the first GNU wave.

Nowadays I use whatever makes business sense.

Yes, because vendor lock-in and all the bad things that comes from Apple makes perfect business sense. /s

Modern MacBooks have absolutely terrible keyboards. So unless you use it like an iPad, you'd be better off with a ThinkPad.

I want to agree with you, I want a Linux daily driver with the quality I am used to from the Mac. But I guess we’re just going to have to agree to disagree on the new mac keyboard being a dealbreaker.

> A metal body is heavy

You are thinking of cast iron, probably.

Aluminum is relatively heavy. Certainly heavier than plastic.

And weight is relative to strength and dimensions in this conversation, right? Plastic starts to get pretty large to match strength of aluminum.

Modern plastic composites with carbon fiber / glass fibers can perform as well or better than metals with regard to strength-to-weight. Plastics also have many other properties that make it preferable for a laptop case. Apple have chosen aluminium to give the impression of build quality. The competition are too often judged by their plastic cases instead of other attributes, such as the lack of glued-in batteries and unreplaceable components.

> Apple have chosen aluminium to give the impression of build quality.

My MBP is going on 6 years old and I have not been gentle with it. In fact I have dropped it on concrete multiple times. It is dented and scraped, the hinge is crooked. It still works perfectly. My previous, plastic laptop (also a Mac) had to have its shell replaced twice (under warranty) in less time than that.

You may feel that aluminum is not worth the trade-offs or the cost, and that's fine, but I want to be clear, the MBP's build quality is not just a shiny facade.

Couldn't agree more. Dropped my last Macbook 7 feet onto concrete and (aside from a dent in the metal) it didn't even flinch.

This. I don't buy MacBook Pro because it has Aluminium body, but because of the quality of the components inside, and how they integrate well with the OS.

My dream computer would be

- ThinkPad like casing. Light weight, yet durable. Not some cheap flimsy plastics.

- XPS like thin bezel display, with Apple like screen with colour calibration. While at it, please give me a 16:10 or some other tall displays where I can have more vertical space. 16:9 is only good for media and it is a secondary use-case on my laptop.

- Components with wider/open source drivers like intel wireless card instead of the Broadcom stuff. Some bluetooth module that has proper working Linux drivers.

- Trackpad - Mac like smooth trackpad. It's been decades and nothing comes even close to what Apple could do.

- Decent 12 hour real world battery life. I don't care if it makes the laptop slightly thicker or heavier - it is worth it.

- Keyboard with a good bit of travel - Like a ThinkPad.

- No Dongle life. Want USB-A, USB-C, HDMI, MiniDP, Full size SD card slot.

So far, only MacBook pro (with VMs running Linux) comes closest with several compromises.

> A metal body is heavy, prone to dents and attenuates radio. Why are you so keen on having one?

I like how it feels and looks. Is that so wrong?

I have used an X1 Carbon for the last year but when I can I will probably go back to the MBP for the trackpad. I guess different people just have different preferences?

Let's be happy there's enough choices to hopefully satisfy everyone.

Yes choice is good. But my concern is that consumers start demanding metal bodies, zero-travel keys and touch-bars everywhere, because Apple, and choice will be reduced. For example, I can no longer buy a mobile phone that doesn't have a glued-in battery.

Are you concerned that consumers start demanding what they want, because it's not what you want?

at least for me, the answer is yes. I'm unsatisfied with almost all the options in laptop market based on my requirements. I just have to choose one, that makes me less unhappy.

Asus and Lenovo have great ultra books running Win10. Ultimate Office 365 support + good battery life. But it lacks a terminal + integrated UNIX utilities.

I prefer to use Linux on my laptop, but at the moment, it is lacking office 365 support. On some brands there is a serious battery issue.

Next option is macOS which has sane shell. But I don't understand, why is there such a huge race toward making thinner laptops? Previous generation MBP, was already thin enough. Consumers demanded thinner laptops. And now I have to bare with thinner MBP but less reliable battery power, fewer ports and a very noisy keyboard (which is disturbing everyone in library).

Should he not be?

I'm not going to prescribe any feeling to them. I don't think they 'should' do anything. Just found it curious to be concerned about other people having different opinions.

I don't think the concern is other people having different opinions in itself. The concern is that by having preferences that are not represented by consumers in general, it is less likely that you'll find your preferences satisfied by a product on the market. If the mainstream is heading towards a set of standards that are uncomfortable to you, I think it's a valid cause for concern.

I can't remember consumers demanding glued-in batteries. I think decisions like this are taken for all kinds of reasons (CEO preference, ease of design and assembly, lock-in, etc) and then presented to consumers as packages that they can accept or decline. But it's too simple to say that this is solely driven by consumer choice.

Consumers demanded slimmer designs over glued in batteries, soldered RAM chips, etc. So the market responded by gluing in batteries and soldering ram. In a way, the consumers did demand that.

I recall many consumer reviews of older Samsung phones criticising the plastic backs and asking for glass or metal.

> ThinkPad trackpad is no smaller than a MacBook from a few years ago.

Why would a comparison with products from years ago be valid here?

> a touchpad with a size that's actually usable

The touchpad is inferior to the trackpoint, so I'd much rather they get rid of it entirely instead.

I wrote off the Trackpoint back in its glory days, but I recant my former position. Trackpoint is the bees knees once you get used to it. The Apple touchpads have gotten huge and easily triggered, Trackpoint is the cure.

On macOS trackpad rejection is quite good, but if you're running anything else it's very frustrating. One of the primary reasons reinstalled macOS... too many triggers on Fedora :(

This is pretty subjective, but I spend a lot more time typing than using the touchpad and while the MBPs touchpad may be nicer, I think the MacBook keyboards can't hold a candle to ThinkPad keyboards. I'm happy to trade a worse touchpad for that any day.

I use a Thinkpad with Linux for work and I agree that the keyboard is better than a MBP's.

However, even though I use the keyboard more than the trackpad, I find that I still rather use a MBP because the difference between the trackpads is greater than the difference between the keyboards. Also I like the screen on the MBP better.

So an HP Elitebook? Some of their mobile workstations are up to military standard.

Are there ThinkPads with touchpads as nice as MacBooks? The touchpad on my T470s is not even close.

Cool, so buy something else; literally every laptop on the market is catering for you, and I'm genuinely happy for you-- but those of us who prefer taller aspect ratios have nothing.. please let us have this.

You’re pretty much describing Purism’s Librem line of laptops:

https://puri.sm/products/librem-13/

Wow. Thanks for sharing. This is amazing... it's like it was made for me but I'm sure my wife won't approve the idea of buying yet another computer. Good daydreaming material, though!

Here's a review and discussion from a few weeks ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16894557

Aren't they just Clevo computers? If so, the ones I've used have _nowhere_ near premium build quality.

Because they are Clevo. In my opinion the whole "linux laptops" are just a scam in general. Virtually all of them are just slapping their logo on top of generic machine from vendor like Clevo or Compal and are saying that those are "machines designed for linux" ... no they aren't. The most that they are doing is to negotiate with Clevo to put a WiFi card that will work with linux out-of-the-box, which is basically the same what you can do yourself.

> No thanks I don't really want black bars when watching movies...

I genuinely never understand people that watch movies on laptops. I find it a wholly unenjoyable experience.

Do you own a TV? You’re missing so much of the experience watching a movie on anything smaller than 45” and TVs are dirt cheap these days. I saw a 65” the other day for $250...

> You’re missing so much of the experience watching a movie on anything smaller than 45”

genuinely curious: given the same resolution, what's the difference between watching a e.g. a 45" from your couch and watching something like a 20" while getting closer to the screen until it covers the same angle of view? Just the fact that it's (probably) more relaxing for your eyes to focus on relatively distant objects?

The TV itself may be cheap but the space it requires probably isn't. How do you fit one 45" screen per person in a small appartment?

I genuinely don't understand why people put huge TV screens in their small rooms given that a smaller screen at closer distance produces the same visual effect.

In my case, I live on a boat so don't have the room for a 45 or 65 inch TV. Laptop it is.

But there are many, many circumstances why you'd watch TV on a laptop. I don't believe airlines would look too fondly on someone dragging their 65" TV on board.

My kids have nice TVs in their room and a rarely see them use them. Instead they watch movies on their Chromebooks majority of the time.

Are go to for the kids are the Acer 14s. Just incredible machines for the money. All aluminum chassis, peppy performance, long battery life, etc. Get them Acer refurb for about $200. Best value you can get.

Wife uses a CB+ and me a PB.

Wife spends a ton of time on her CB+ and does often time watch movies on it. While I never do on my PB. Often times she will be watching a movie on hers laying in our bed while I am watching something on our TV in our bedroom.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com