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Comment by overcast | Hacker News Reader

If you're a hiker, permethrin. Spray down your socks, pants, shirts. Let it dry. You're good to go for a dozen outings. Non toxic to humans, and orderless.

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Permethrin is definitely the best option. But if you're running out at the last minute and don't have time to pretreat your clothing, Consumer Reports has a good guide to the best bug sprays on the market:

https://www.consumerreports.org/products/insect-repellent/ra...

E.g. both of these get high marks:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00F8AMY92

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015KG5NK

DEET seems to be more effective than the Picaridin for ticks, but if you have a sensitivity to DEET then Picaridin may be the next best option and supposedly doesn't smell as bad.

>doesn't smell as bad

If you look up the MSDS for DEET, it's actually odorless. The classic smell of Off! isn't from the DEET, and you can get odorless versions of it. I found a very good one in Moscow a few years back that just smelled like hand cream.

Not legal in Canada.

Then again there's few ticks in Canada's north, so Canadian hikers should just explore the northern part of their provinces.

Yes, but Lake Huron has some of the best dunes and freshwater beaches in Canada. It'd be hard to give that up.

Might need to carry a flame thrower for the black flies though!

That's unfortunate, I still spray before I leave to hike in Banff from the US though :)

Not legal to sell, but legal to possess. I go across the border and stock up at REI in Bellingham. No problems bringing it back across. Apparently this is quite common for lower mainland residents. When I brought 4 big bottles of the stuff up to the register, the first thing they asked was if I was Canadian.

Ah yeah that's a good distinction that I should have made.

I think I read somewhere that it's used by the Canadian Forces as well, but not made available to civilians.

I wonder why you can't sell it here. They even recommend it on the government's travel site:

https://travel.gc.ca/travelling/health-safety/insect-bite

according to wikipedia permethrin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permethrin kills bees...

Sure but how many bees are you rubbing up against on a hike?

I'm pretty sure it kills all insects, but the bees would have to land on your treated clothing to be affected.

One can guess that the primary source of release of the chemical is not by rubbing yourself on things, but from washing your clothes. Thus, it would end up in the oceans.

When the alternative is Lyme Disease? I'm not giving it up. My cousin is severely affected by it right now, in her brain, affecting everything. It's awful.

You can get Japanese Knotweed powder from Montana Farmacy. It helped a friend of mine he is now functional. One or two tablespoons a day.

It would be so dilute by that point that it would not be worth worrying about.

More important than the concentration it degrades fairly quickly in water.

The ocean has a lot of water in it, and it is unlikely to be deadly at such low concentrations.

I think it only kills on contact with clothing, so as long as the bees don't run into you they're good.

Is it part of colony collapse disorder?

I see it like antibiotics - local usage probably pales in comparison to agricultural/industrial usage (e.g. sheep dip [1] and neonicotinoid usage [2] )

Yeah, I don't think dousing yourself with insecticide is all that dangerous unless you're doing it constantly like the agricultural examples above.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheep_dip

[2] https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/press-releases/study-stren...

If you live in a target area, on the first of each month May-August treat all outdoor running and hiking shoes for your whole family. Also for dogs and cats use Frontline.

As long as you don’t get any in any water as it will kill fish.

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