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Comment by ianai | Hacker News Reader

You’re not wrong. But you’re also attributing choice to things that may not be choice. In your description, if a tech worker wants a cheaper lifestyle and larger living space then they should move away from basically the only places they can find those highest paying careers. There are exceptions, but they are not numerous enough to dismiss that current prices exceed many explanations and leave many people wanting.

Also, long commutes to work (longer than 20 minutes) do a great harm to the world. Both in opportunity cost from being able to do other things through to things like climate change.

Edit-Also, I want to live in a world where spending the morning in a coffee shop with a scone is affordable on at least a weekly basis for people. Cafes, restaurants, and other such places are cultural bases. We should be insulating them from destruction.

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There are tons of places with great opportunity for that tech worker and non-absurd cost of living. I understand ambitious people wanting to stay in the Bay Area where all the tippy-top jobs are, but there are very good jobs elsewhere. You're just much less likely to become a billionaire or a top executive or a well known name in the industry outside the Bay Area. But again, that isn't a middle class sort of concern.

Living in the Bay Area is not just about access to tippy top tech companies. It's about limiting risk.

Say I'm living in Nowhereville, USA, and working for the tech company there. If anything goes wrong, for example, an overall tech downturn, this company hits hard times, or I have a job-ending disagreement with my boss, then getting a new job likely means a 6+ month job search, uprooting my family and moving. I know this is true because I have lived in several towns like this. It sucks.

In the Bay Area, if things don't work out with a particular company, I can apply to hundreds of others next door. I'm in for a 3-6 month job search, and at the end of the day I don't have the hassle of moving to a different city.

Ah, more elitism from the Valley folk. If you were to leave your bubble for a bit, you’d find any significant urban area offers the same benefit: Chicago, NYC, Boston, etc.

With about the same cost of living. I don’t think he was referencing those cities when he said “Nowhereville”.

Chicago is very cheap.

That's true, but it would be better to compare the Bay to other cities. DC for example has a robust economy, great culture, better weather than new York, and home prices 1/3rd of the Bay when looking at the surrounding suburbs.

I think there are so many misconceptions about the rest of the country’s tech scene. I’ve been in tech for almost 30 years now. The only time I lived on the coast was in Portland Oregon. More often in the midwest. There are tech jobs, that pay very well compared to the cost of living, everywhere. I’ve never been out of work for more than two weeks.

Stay near one of the top 100 cities in the country and there are almost no issues with employment if you keep your skills somewhat updated.

Edit: I should mention I, and all my co-workers, also don’t work remote. Turns out companies everywhere use technology :)

I've lived in Atlanta GA for over 20 years. During that time it has never taken me more than 3 weeks to find a job once I started looking - always paying more.

In 2012, I walked out on a contract job on Monday during lunch (long story), called a recruiter and I had a job offer with what was then a Fortune 10 company by Thursday evening making 10K more.

In late 2014, I called recruiters and had two job offers making 25K more.

Earlier this year, it took 10 days and now I'm making yet another 20K more.

I'm no special snowflake. I'm still just making the median salary for Atlanta, a lot of my former coworkers can tell a similar story.

When I'm looking for a job, usually I'm juggling between 5-10 opportunities. I always use recruiters, so I am not blindly submitting resumes.

Friends who went the Bay Area route seem to be in a much higher risk situation then those who stuck it out in the Midwest.

You might be able to pick up a new job overnight in the Bay Area, but conversely your employer can replace you overnight in the Bay Area. Friends who went out there are constantly jumping between companies as they run the risk of being laid off, of running into stack ranking, of their firm getting bought out or all other kinds of nonsense.

Midwestern friends? All still working for the same spot they got out of college. Pay might be low, but the stress is low as well since employers know that it's hard work to replace a competent developer (probably have to pay someone to move there). If they walk out, it's the firm that's going to be in a harder place then they will be -- so no one is going to ask them to work overtime, check their e-mails, or do anything to upset their applecart.

Sure, (I live in ultra-expensive NYC because of economic opportunity) but you can still a) compromise on the type/size/cost of housing you choose within the city; b) carpool or commute by bike or transit if you're concerned about the environment; and c) cut back on the other expenses that the hypothetical family in the article is being anything but frugal about.

This is a great point. It's easy to just classify NYC as expensive, but the truth is that there's a great deal of range in living costs in NYC area, including outside of the strict definition of NYC proper, while still maintaining reasonable commute times.

Either you have denser housing near jobs with impact on living space or you have longer commutes.

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