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Comment by hitekker | Hacker News Reader

I recently heard from friends of friends that Zapier conducts reference checks on its candidates without the candidates' permission. By that I mean: finding previous coworkers on LinkedIn, contacting them out-of-the-blue and asking for an appraisal of the person they may-or-may-not have once worked with.

Is there any truth to this rumor?

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We use a service called SkillSurvey for reference checks. It asks the candidate for references in an automated fashion and then the feedback is collected fairly anonymously.

We try to be respectful of people’s situations — EG: it’s never appropriate to contact a current employer without permission. We don’t do that.

Cool, makes sense to me.

So to be clear, you only contact references that the candidate provided to you and not others such as connections on LinkedIn? Your answer doesn't seem to specifically deny that you contact people not specifically provided, other than employers.

By the way I read a little on your job site and Zapier sounds like a great place to work :-)

“Indirect” references are common in SV.

It would be weird if they randomly found and messaged people from LinkedIn etc. I have, however, seen interviewers and recruiters at a lot of companies reach out to mutual contacts if they find any, and because the SV network is so tight this happens a lot.

> randomly found and messaged people from LinkedIn

We definitely do not do that. As mentioned elsewhere in the thread, I'll double check internally and make it super clear that isn't acceptable.

In situations like this, lack of explicit denial is generally confirmation.

That is correct. It is our policy to use the tool I mentioned elsewhere in the thread which only contacts the references provided by the candidate -- I'll check internally to make sure no one is deviating from that process.

I really appreciate this kind of direct transparency

I interviewed there in August 2017 and they used a service for reference checks that I provided several contacts to.

Is there something wrong with doing this?

Yes. They may not want people to know they are considering leaving their current job. And they may not keep their job if people find out they aren't fully committed.

It’s immoral behavior on the employers part to not ask for permission. IMHO it shows how they will be to work for if you take a job.

I don't get why people downvoted you. It is definitely expected that potential employers ask permission. People may apply while having a current job, and not wanting their boss to find out.

Wow, I didn't realize my expectation was so different. I've always assumed people wouldn't contact my current employer, but why not my previous employers? You're right that it's better to ask permission, then you gain more information about the relationship too. Hm.. good food for thought.

Not everything on linkedin is up-to-date or correct. Then there's the issue of some people personally knowing others but the information not being on linkedin. It's pretty easy to accidentally cold call someone for references who will talk to the candidates current employer, and this may even be the reason the candidate left them off of the reference list in the first place.

This is something I've never really thought about, the ethics of reference checks. Is anyone aware of a good guide or thoughtful article on the subject?

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