Hacker News Reader

Comment by jedberg | Hacker News Reader

Not sure why you're getting downvotes, but you're absolutely right.

A lot of the housing issues would go away if people in the Bay Area (ie. my neighbors) didn't vote down every single thing that would allow more than a single family home. I'm ok with my home price being cut in 1/2 if it means more middle class people can move in. Most of my neighbors aren't.

There is a "missing middle" of housing throughout the entire Bay Area of 4-8 unit apartment buildings near transit.

SB827, flawed as it is, is trying to fix this. If it passes, SF basically won't be able to block construction anymore, regardless of what the residents want. If it passes you'll see a lot of eight story buildings replacing single family homes.

View on HN

If you were a resident before everybody started moving in, wouldn't you want to have a say to how the land is used in the city you own property in? Playing devil's advocate, a lot of SF natives didn't want tech to be here in the first place. (I'm born and raised in SF but also in tech. I have a lot of family and friends who complain about the "gentrification", and they have every right to)

Isn't this more or less identical to anti-immigrant sentiment at the national level, and isn't that something that's rather politically unpopular in SF? Isn't this a bit hypocritical?

I think when a ton of people move into a place you call home all at once, you can't blame people for being upset about their habitat right? Anti-immigration sentiment at the national level is just Trump enforcing our current immigration laws plus some other hateful stuff. SF residents prior to 2012 has seen what they turned into their habitat transform into this overly crowded tech land full with prices for all sorts of goods going up. Once again just playing devil's advocate I feel they have every right to be upset.

Me as the techie and SF native do feel like they are using their oligopoly for selfish personal gain and would love to see more people go out and actually vote on these zoning laws to allow more complexes to be built

I did move in before prices went crazy, and yes, I'd like to have a say. But people aren't negotiating "in good faith". They simply want to keep their property values sky high, without regard to what is good for the community.

They don't realize that their plumber and their house cleaner and their kid's teachers can't afford to live nearby anymore, which means they will either have to pay a fortune for those services, or deal with crappy service. They refuse to see the big picture and realize that sky high housing prices aren't what should be optimized for.

And now, because of their stubbornness, SB827 is going to come in and take away any control they had. Now local residents will have zero say in what happens, because the state is going to set the rules. So now we won't get a say in what's actually important because a bunch of stubborn people wouldn't allow anyone to do anything.

Yes I think you are right that one reason for this is homeowners want their property to continue to skyrocket. But really, can you blame them for that? If you were a homeowner wouldn't you rather have your house worth more?

The second reason for skyrocketing housing prices is the rise in wages. If people didn't get paid so much in the city, rent prices could not possibly be as high as it currently is. So while we do pay a crap ton in rent, most of us who can afford that rent probably are still WAAAAY better off than the average american.

> But really, can you blame them for that? If you were a homeowner wouldn't you rather have your house worth more?

I am a Bay Area homeowner, and no, I do not want that. I'm able to see the long term effects of that, and realize that in the end it will bad for me, bad for everyone around me, and bad for my community, when all the people that provide services in our community get priced out.

And the wages are only going up because of the housing costs. If the costs weren't so high, companies would not have to pay so much to get people to move here, which is the main driver in determining wages.

You hit the nail on the head though with "most of us who can afford that rent probably are still WAAAAY better off than the average american". Not everyone can afford the high rents. And eventually there won't be anyone left to provide any services, or the cost of those services will have to go up, and people will move away even faster as companies decide it just isn't worth paying that much anymore and start locating elsewhere.

I am an SF homeowner, and I look forward to all the new development in my neighborhood. I want to see more people out and about, especially people from more walks of life than just tech.

It's weird that it's come to self-described "socialist" groups like DSA and Gay Shame chastising people like me, a homeowner, for advocating against my financial interests in favor of members of my generation who are less well off. Bay Area housing politics are wild.

Hey, you're an awesome person for fighting against your financial interests in favor of members of your generation. Don't let other people bring you down on that!

I'm very glad people like you 2 exist because I too would love cheaper rents along with welcoming a more diverse crowd outside of tech. I am also a homeowner and would vote in favor for building more complexes to lower rent for people of lower income to stay in San Francisco. Was just playing devil's advocate and saying that it seems like most SF homeowners don't think the way we do

A lot of longtime residents of Bay Area suburbs got to be residents in the first place because of redlining and other discriminatory practices. I don't think they have a particular right to perpetuate their communities' exclusivity.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com