Lyft says nearly 250K of its passengers ditched a personal car in 2017

Renting a car (via Getaround, Zipar) on weekends can be cost effective

Indeed, this is something that gets totally missed by advocates of on-demand self-driving yadda yadda, because they live in densely populated cities and socialise and get entertainment almost exclusively online. That demographic is overrepresented on HN. Most people who own cars who might use them to commute during the week use them for fun stuff at the weekends too, for which glorified taxis are just not suitable.

Depends on where you live and what you do outside. Over the years, I have ridden my bike to half a dozen different countries, starting from my doorstep. That might be rare, but it's definitely not "impossible without a car".

I also happen to have access to a very active market for skiing/snowboarding weekend trips where a bus takes you to an hotel in the mountains on Friday night, you spend two days on the slopes and get back on Sunday evening. There are all kinds of people on those buses and most of them arrive at the meeting point by car, so it's definitely not a choice made out of necessity.

Zipcars with ski racks might be a little hard to find in Seattle during the winter, but they do exist.

I own a car bet it much more feasible to ride the train and walk briefly. Parking is free and only a mile to the closest train stop.

My employers building has a free parking deck. Does Seattle not have free parking decks is some larger buildings?

5miles is very close to downtown. Street parking sort of works, if you get enough mercy from your neighbors not parking on-street.

[1] To be fair, the US wreaked havoc across its cities in the 60s and 70s, so it's a lot more common here than it should be.

Now that I'm in Seattle (well, Bellevue), the beauty of the PNW has me going on several hours of driving and exploration every weekend. Good luck doing that without a personal vehicle. Also, my commute is agonizing, but even in a personal car it's still orders of magnitude more time efficient than the public transportation options, and I can get all my random errands for the family done during.

I'm probably preaching to the choir by replying to you, but my car is now an indispensable part of my life. I could only imagine not having it being in the densest and most "isolated" American cities at this point (Chicago, Manhattan possibly).

I have a car, but I'm not the one paying insurance on it anymore (passed on to other family member). The car was 5000 EUR used (Volkswagen Polo) which was bought 7-8 years ago and it was a 5 year old car back then. Right now it's really getting old, but only needed a fix last year or so and new tires this year (not my concern anymore though). But it's safe to say those cost about 800 EUR in total. The car insurance is what I'd guess 400 EUR.

I'm glad that I live in a city where biking is the #1 priority, I wouldn't feel safe biking in the US. It's also a lot cheaper!

I've never really felt limited, though certainly there are places that would be expensive for me to get to thanks to the need of long taxi rides etc., but there are also far more places to go than I can get to see in a lifetime that are still easily accessible with public transport.

I something think maybe I should get a license so I could at least rent a car for certain places, but I've just never felt it's been important enough to get around to it.

Had I lived in the US, the situation certainly would be different - I have spent quite a lot of time in the Bay Area without a car pre-Uber/Lyft, and it certainly is possible but awkward even when you're there as a single person, and many other places I've visited in the US has been much worse.

But the thing is, I can totally see a lot of people there too adapting their life after what works with these services. A car is practical in some respects, but you have to deal with service and insurance and parking, and without it you can often spend a portion of that money living in a location where there's less need for a car to begin with, and a portion of it on taxis/Uber/Lyft. And then I can sit back and read or nap.

Of course it depends on the type of jobs you want etc.

The only downside of not having a license is getting into bars. Bartenders don't like expired ids and I've been looking into getting a new one.

While I don't recommend skipping the driver's license despite these circumstances, I can understand that it's a legitimate option for a teenager that doesn't plan to drive.

Of course, parents could turn on the contact tracking in an iPhone.

And besides, driving their own car doesn't free them from that tracking: https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=572519...

Not take an Uber, but then cars cost money too, a lot of it.

Even if you do not drive regularly, insurance,registration and parking must be paid.

That statement is very strange to me. If you really enjoy nature, I think the last possible thing you'd do is buy a car solely to go see said nature. Seems entirely wrong to me.

Best thing you can do for those mountains if you love them is not purchase a vehicle.

It's likely that people who like to stay indoors, spend more time on the computer, perhaps coding... perhaps working as a developer...

This paints you as a very limited person if you are living in the US, because the "things that you want to do" exclude:

-pretty much all the great outdoor activities and nature that the US has to offer (National/State Parks);

-getting to know your own country and traveling within it

-going to any place or event outside the city (for most people, shelling out $100+ on Uber each way is a barrier)

I know where you're coming from, I used to live in NYC and didn't drive. I got my license when I moved to TX for grad school at the age of 24 - and I didn't even need it to get to work (I've been biking to campus for 7 years). But I did use the car for all the "rosy" things, and with that came the realization of how much I was missing out on.

The thing is, you don't even know what you are missing out on. You are a person who doesn't travel, and says they don't want to. You are practically tied to your community. How often do you get beyond the 50-mile radius of your home? 100-mile radius?

Now, if you were living in Europe, that wouldn't be the case. You would be able to travel without owning a car. Owning a car there has smaller marginal benefits.

But you don't live in Europe. Public transportation in the US is horrible, even when you add a hefty dose of Uber/Lyft to it. It's a sad state of affairs, and I wish it weren't that way. I support public transport initiatives when I can.

Choosing not to have a license is voluntarily confining oneself to a very small subset of the country. Uber won't get you to the Rockies. A rental will (so you don't need to own a car), but you still need to drive it.

Yes, it's a hassle (at first; after some time, people start to enjoy it). Yes, it takes effort, time and money. But to say that you don't WANT to have the benefits it gives you in this country, one must at least somewhat be aware of what they are.

Of course, to each - their own. But I got to see the total solar eclipse. And you might read how amazing it was in a book on a train one day.

PS: I apologize for the somewhat-deliberately provoking tone. On a softer note, have you read "On The Road" by Jack Kerouac? If so, do you honestly say that you want none of that? If not, you're in luck, because reading it is a marvelous experience: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Road

This book is culturally significant; but as a side effect, it might change how you see driving.

The entire US is effectively "car culture" - and in my (and others) opinions, that car culture has effectively killed our society. Maybe permanently.

You cannot have a functional society when the majority of productive people sequester themselves off from "the others" into little boxes set apart from each other, never interacting with anyone unless it's a planned social engagement. Typically that means extreme segregation - which we're seeing.

The car - and the resulting car-based society (basically every single community/transportation project in the past 50+ years has been car-centric) - gives you the beginnings of the total social breakdown we are experiencing.

That wouldn't be an entirely bad thing necessarily - it would mean people chose that. Unfortunately they didn't. Car culture (and the suburban culture it enabled) was subsidized by the rest of society practically from day one.

And besides, isn't it the other way around? Unless you're living in one of a few extremely narrow areas of very specific cities, the really wealthy people live outside the urban core.

But we should be talking about designing our society around more bikes, transit and walking.

Transportation should be accessible to everyone - those too young for a license, too handicapped to walk or drive, those unable to afford a car.

I think our health, environment, liviability and community would all be done a great service by demphasizing the single passenger car and it's accessories (sprawl, acres of parking, endless noise, pollution and isolated commutes)

Incredible as it may seem, there are people in the world who have life experiences and perspectives that differ from yours. Unsurprisingly, that results in them also having different opinions and making different choices.

Clearly you feel that you've reached some kind of moral high ground, but there's no need to sneer at the rest of us from it.

Would you please not post flamebait to HN? It's against the guidelines and reliably wrecks discussion here.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

And then when I -did- live close to work (about 2 blocks) I had to cross the town's main street, where I was catcalled about every day and on multiple occasions had a man follow me home even after telling them politely each time that I was not interested. Horray. People here don't walk. So you stand out. When I was in the city I could wear a big heavy coat and most people will ignore you because you look poor/ugly, here even in my most ratty coat people still followed me...ugh.

Making life easier for people who choose to not own cars, has positive impact for those who can't own cars (and not to even begin on reducing the negative externalities).

For the record, I own a car but also frequently hauled a baby stroller and a diaper bag to the metro train (though only for one kid). The secret was to have a stroller that was geared for walking not the SUV sized strollers so popular with the SUV set.

When I was growing up my family had a car, but around middle school it was possible to bike to any school/sports/extracurricular activity within 20 minutes. My parents kept the car for a number of reasons, but getting to work was numero uno. If getting to work was simpler with public transportation then we would have been able to get rid of the car much more easily.

Now living in a big city - Amsterdam - makes living without a car magnitudes easier.

Outside a city of course, the equation is different and public transport just can't work for everyone, but in large cities life would be better if no-one had cars.

Kids take the bus all the time with their parents. My brother, sister,and I took the bus all the time with my mom or grandma or occasionally both when we were very young. Sometimes when we'd add in a few cousins too, then we'd be rolling 8+ deep.

My parents car was always breaking down and my grandma never learned to drive so it was just totally normal to hear "we're taking the bus today."

When we were a little older (ages 3 4 and 6ish) we would take the bus with the teenage babysitter and her friend to go do something (usually it was ice skating).

It's just such a non-issue.

I really can't understand what sort of "problem" you'd have that you wouldn't have, say, walking on the sidewalk, or going to a store, or just leaving the house at all.

BTW, met a few people with marginal income. They totally wrecked their credit by buying a car. They did not foresee the TCO on a car. After loan payments, insurance, gas, and maintenance they were barely keeping afloat. Payday loans finally sank them and the cars ended up being repossessed anyway. They are still stuck paying the loan since the bank fees and depreciation weren't removed.

It was not a problem.

It's like sampling people in an airport to get stats on how often everyone flies.

However, when multiple people use a lyft car throughout the day, it is more efficient than having each person own their own car. Maintenance, insurance, and the construction of the car itself are all shared.

Perhaps it's half a full time car off the road.

You can lease a Fiat 500e for $90/month in California (which is what I do).

That has the added benefit of removing fuel costs too.

Arkansas does not run any emissions checks outside of 2 counties. However when I lived in texas they did. The cost was state limited to $5/year. Falls under the category of maintenance.

As for accidents I have 2 on record. one at fault and one not. I am not running the cheapest insurance but I am insuring a 90s/2000s car. It is much less than full coverage on a newer one. If I had a new car that I could not afford to eat the replacement costs I would definitely run full coverage but as it sits it is better not to.

I do not drink or smoke. Driving sleepy something I rarely do although it happens sometimes. However if I nod at all Ill pull over and park it. Not worth the risk. As for drinking uber and lyft is by far better. I was never trying to argue against them when needed. But for an only vehicle it seems to be higher costs.

I do treat my cars as disposable. When a transmission goes out and I can get a better car all around for less than a transmission rebuild would cost I don't waste the money fixing what I already have. I usually get a new (to me) car ever 2-4 years. I put yearly in my calculations because buying a nicer $3000 car every 3 years averages out to the same cost.

If anything I over estimated the cost out here although I do admit that the big cost other keep mentioning is parking and nobody around here charges for parking outside of meters downtown. and those are 10c/12 minutes. But if you live were those are an issue the cost would be more.

(1)A bit off topic but it can vary widely. I have taken a single tire to walmart for work several times. Took up to 3 hours to get done and never under 1 hour. However we have had a Discount Tire (The actual name. The service is not discount) open up here recently and I have had 2 vehicles in and out. car one was 2 tires in 15 minutes and 3 (spare) in 20 minutes. Car two was a set of 4 in 22 minutes. At this point I would recommend my local one to just about anybody. It greatly suprised me how good the service could be.

If you buy a 10,000$ car every 10 years that's 1,000$/year. Also, if you don't drive much you can average less than 1,000$/year in depreciation without driving a junker.

Nor do they ride their bicycles.

In fact, anything other than 4 wheels (or dad on two) will have them mysteriously taking a sick day. +30C or -30C, no difference.

You forgot "circling for twenty minutes searching for parking." Include the parking footprint of private cars and I think ridesharing comes out ahead.

A) from less usage because of Uber

B) because all these extra taxis have caused mass congestion which means buses are unbelievably slow compared to even a few years ago