>> FWIW, preparing for interviews is standard practice irrespective of the industry.
Industry is sane. They ask stuff relevant to actual work or real basics. They don't make a gameable process full of rules and techniques.
Industry is sane. They ask stuff relevant to actual work or real basics. They don't make a gameable process full of rules and techniques.
* Is attractive enough (compensation, lifestyle, etc.)
* and has a larger supply of qualified applicants than desirable positions
Will result in applicants preparing for however they are interviewed, tested, etc. This isn't unique to software engineering interviews. People prepare for interviews or exams in finance, law, medicine, etc. They all have a system that is gameable. It might be newer in software engineering interviews, but that is mostly because CS is now incredibly popular and top talent is compensated very well.
That you think interviews and exams are interchangeable concepts illustrates the problem. Nothing wrong with a rigorous filter at the gates of the profession, but lawyers don’t need to spend months studying for each company’s half-assed version of the bar exam each time they change jobs. Our industry is dysfunctional because, unlike law and medicine, no one trusts the credentialing mechanisms.
The bootcamp style of skilled labour generation is possible simply because of the demand-supply gap.
You can't learn and practice surgery yourself. On the other hand, you can teach yourself software engineering. You can be practitioner with nothing more than a computer - and so many people are.
That doesn't mean CS degrees are a hoax - it just means the field is more accessible to those without college degrees (though its definitely going to be a more difficult path).
At least in Europe things are a bit more strict.
Would you disagree if people from the US did not need to pass the bar to call themselves lawyers, or the equivalent for doctors? Is it just because I compared this specific thing from the US in a negative light compared to EU?
In terms of PE / CENG status its more who you know that what you know :-)
Sorry if I forgot anything, fellow Europeans.
Core tech behind computers is more than just a network protocol that got lucky.
In case you missed it, Robert Metcalfe is an electrical engineer.
It is quite different to have spent 5 years doing nothing other than building up engineering knowledge, and just learning a few things to get the job done.
I'm always very weary of companies that tell me I'll earn more money because I have a PhD completely irrelevant to the job I'll be hired to do. It signals that they're valuing the wrong thing, and that doesn't make me want to work there.
Engineers are only those with an university degree from an university acknowledged to actually be teaching engineering.
Then if they want to actually make use of the title, get the credential, which yes requires an yearly contribution.
Finally, in any kind of project where human lives are at stake, the engineer signing for the project has to be validated as such.
I happen to think that our profession is no different from lawyers, doctors, mechanical engineering, civil engineering, and so on.
Even the FAANG companies aren't immune from bad hires or people who burn out.
At the same time, the "person who can work with the business user on the software, think about the architecture of it, identify the design necessary, come up with the estimate that actually matches the time frame that it will be done in with a reasonable error... and produce software that takes X as input and provides Y as output while being aware of where the edge conditions may exist and ask for clarification on how it should work"... I believe there is a distinct lack of that portion of labor.
Furthermore, there is also a lack of people who are able to move from the first labor pool to the second, and a lack of mentors who have the time and ability to help that group move to the second.
I don't think its incredibly difficult to hire an entry level person as long as one sets the bar low enough and has people within the origination who are capable of providing the design. On the other hand, it is very difficult to find the people who can give the necessary instruction to the entry level people to allow them to become productive within their ability.
As an aside, I also find that within the entry level group... there are a sizable portion that have the attitude of "I learned language X and that was hard enough, I'm going to stick with it and not learn anything else." That X can be found for all languages and none have the monopoly on it. However, it is disconcerting for me to see those individuals... I started out as a C programmer, and then Perl (full stack web - some JavaScript in there) and then Java (enterprise), and then Java stand alone (swing application)... and while I'm still a Java programmer, I can see other languages looming on the horizon. Java will become the COBOL, and while there are still COBOL programmers out there, its not something that one wants to get stuck in for another two or three decades waiting for that last app server to be turned off before they can retire.
Why would culture developed skills that make you rewarded less?
The ability to teach juniors is not searched for nor rewarded either, where social skills are even sometimes treated as something that makes you less good as programmer.
There's also a sizeable portion of companies that have the attitude of "we want someone who's really passionate and good at learning. oh and they need to be expert in language x. oh you're not an expert in x? sorry, we can't wait for you to learn it. we don't care if you learnt something else"