Hacker News Reader

Comment by tlb | Hacker News Reader

Maybe a good idea, but the site does a bad job of selling it.

The front page starts with a big rant about how bad existing airlines are. That's not how you sell things. You should focus on what you do, which is SFO-LAX flights through private terminals on a monthly subscription.

The private terminal is a huge win -- it saves a good hour on travel. But that's buried in the FAQ. You should redesign so that all of the following are on above the fold on the home page:

- SFO-LAX

- Monthly subscription $79/6 flights

- Private terminal

- Book online last minute

Don't pretend to be a full-service airline except in the fine print it says only SFO-LAX. SFO-LAX is exactly what thousands of people need. For people who need something else, you shouldn't lead them on (but you should let them give you their email address and desired routes so you can let them know when you add them.)

View on HN

Thanks for the great feedback. This was our site's first draft so we really appreciate your comments. We'll definitely update it and keep your points above the fold on the homepage. We weren't aware that the private terminals are such an appealing feature to people, but that aspect has been a feature that we've been receiving a lot of positive feedback about so we appreciate you pointing it out. Thank you again and we'll make those changes by tomorrow.

Also the site is effectively broken on iPad, in both landscape and portrait. Something funky with your layout makes most of the objects appear half offscreen to the sides.

Sorry about that, we're working on fixing the site now.

Blog link is dead.

Sorry about that, we're in the process of fixing the site now.

Minor optimization for the phone image? Have it show the next flight that could reasonably be booked if I had the app installed, rather than one from 2017. As in, if you had this app, you could be on the (it's 2.05 right now) 2:30 pm flight, just press this button. Helps drive the immediacy and ease home.

Yep, great idea. We were actually thinking about an interface like that. Thanks for the feedback

Can you do BFI<->SFO?

To save you guys a Google:

>Boeing Field, officially King County International Airport (IATA: BFI), is a public airport owned and operated by King County, five miles south of downtown Seattle, Washington.

Maybe have a calculator on the website that lets you put in the start and end of your journey, tweak things like how far in advance you want to arrive at the airport with some set minimum (e.g. need to arrive at sfo at least 1 hours before), then can compare your offering vs the standard home-sfo-lax-end destination. it's the kind of info most people would have to piece together with Google maps, having it in the site would be pretty easy to do, and where there is a big time saving, becomes a pretty strong motivator to "sign up now"

100% agree on the messaging here.

Is it use it or lose it type flights?

I didn't even notice the private terminal stuff (didn't get that far). I thought it was some type of group buying thing on big carriers like Delta, etc.

Private terminal is a huge win. I know some friends who want to live in LA but work remotely in SF. 1-2 flights a month in a private terminal for this pricing seems like a steal especially when you can shave off terminal/travel time at big airports.

This could be awesome for companies and employees. I could see a company having a remote employee in LA but wanting have a face to face meeting in the next 24 hours. Tickets would be super expensive but if you had a plan like this you could just fly them in fast. And if you needed more flights you could always book commercial.

A corporate plan for x flights per month without a named passenger would be interesting, too. This would be useful for companies with employees in both cities who occasionally need to meet face to face with the other team. It would certainly be easier, faster, and probably cheaper than the cluster that arranging corporate travel currently is.

We're currently speaking with companies about something similar to this.

I noticed in your FAQ that you are flying Bombardier regional jets, which "are the same planes that are used by United Express, Delta Connection, and American Airlines".

There was a big stink* a few years ago about the big airlines using new pilots on regional routes and paying them so little that many were on food stamps. I don't want to put my life in the hands of someone who is worried about where their kids' next meal will come from. What is the starting salary for your pilots?

* https://www.wimp.com/michael-moore-pilots-on-food-stamps/

https://www.reddit.com/r/flying/comments/1wxkki/pilots_on_fo...

https://blogs.wsj.com/corporate-intelligence/2014/02/12/flyi...

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/23265283-pilots-on-food-...

Come on man, they are trying to get a startup running and are competing on price. Heaving a great benefit package for their employees is not core to that value proposition. If this is someone's main decicion point when choosing an airline they probably are better of with one of the big brand airlines.

I am also agreeing with the other comments on don't bash your competition that much. If you have a good offer - and you do - you don't have to do that. You just need to highlight your core benefits/conditions - your two hubs and the private terminal time saver.

SFO -> LAX is a $79 roundtrip. In your mind, how does this compete on price?

Did you read this point of the comment?

"I don't want to put my life in the hands of someone who is worried about where their kids' next meal will come from."

Salaries for our pilots are as competitive as major commercial carriers. A reason pilots have been interested in flying with us.

Just FYI this reads to me as “we are also paying them peanuts.”

Since your question is about salaries, it's not clear why you mention the type of jet they fly -- seems that your question would apply whether they are flying Gulfstream Business Jets, or Airbus A380's

Though I think you're more at risk on your drive to the airport from the truck or bus driver in the next lane that earns less money than a pilot.

It is use it or lose it flights. Flights don't role over. We're kicking around the idea of trying to make giving unused flights to friends or family work.

Companies have shown a lot of interest in this. Most beneficial aspect is booking late with paying a high fare.

I didn't even realize there was anything below the fold as the black div looked like a footer :S, went straight to the FAQ.

It is use it or lose it flights. Flights don't role over. We're kicking around the idea of trying to make giving unused flights to friends or family work. Companies have shown a lot of interest in this. Most beneficial aspect is booking late with paying a high fare.

I am not your target market. I just wanted to say you are handling the feedback here better than most people seem to. I think that is a real strength, both in terms of PR and in terms of suggesting that you are prepared to learn and adapt. Both of those are important factors in success.

I will agree that the website talks too much trash about other services. Maybe list all the customary fees people expect that you don't have. That would be valuable information and doesn't require trash talking anyone. Something like:

No fee to print tickets.

No cancellation fee.

No bag check fee.

No other hidden fees.

Just one low price stated up front so you know exactly what to expect.

I will suggest that you might try apologizing less and thanking people more. It is more of a position of strength. For example, instead of apologizing that the site does not work on iPad, you could say something like "That's good info. We will get right on it. Thanks for letting us know."

Your replies here are fairly solid. I am not suggesting they are bad. I am only hoping to help you further up your game.

Best of luck.

Wow, I was super confused until I read this comment.

I also didn't realize this included a private terminal. I thought this was just a way to book last minute fares without surprises, which didn't really make sense because I just checked and it's cheaper to book a round trip from SFO - LAX leaving any time this week with the airline ($117 on United vs. $156 w/ you).

The private terminal aspect is why we charge a little more than other airlines' lowest fares. It looks like we need to do a better job of highlighting the private terminal feature on our site. Thanks for the great feedback.

looks like you guys are working on some improvements for this great idea. what platform are you using to manage the recurring billing part?

We're using stripe

but presumably with much less waiting around?

Yes, exactly. Just arrive 15 minutes before departure time.

Ah just like the good old days on the BA LHR to EDI route run up to the counter whack the card down and wait less than 30 mins for the next flight.

Just time for a cheeky pint as the lounge next to the boarding way had a bar.- the afternoon cream teas where nice as well.

Yep, or on People's Express NYC to DC

Yeah... that's United economy. Any change costs you money. And you have to fly United, which... no. Not even for a short hop.

I happily would pay $40 more for easy changes + private terminal.

Looks like some older iteration located here which does a better job presenting what they are trying to sell and how it's better

https://www.jumpdrive.io/index.html

Yep, we have two different landing pages live. Trying to get our copy right

I disagree about the rant. I like when sites explain how and why they're different and better than the traditional services.

What does a "private terminal" mean ? Or rather, in what precise way is it better ? I have a vague idea of what it can provide but I'm not sure how it can shed up to an hour of time. Does it include a dedicated secrity and immigration service (so no gigantic lines) ?

No TSA security. No big-airline check-in lines.

Immigration doesn't apply on domestic flights anyway.

The site says the terminal still has TSA security, which makes sense, these aren’t exactly private jets.

Which is a bit curious as it sounds like a GA terminal, which generally just have a guard who keeps random people from walking around on the tarmac.

But i'm guessing they are trying to be in the grey area between being a charter and being a full blown commercial airline service with a regular schedule, requiring them to use the normal passenger terminals (and lease/buy gate space/etc).

A private terminal is a smaller terminal in a different location than the main terminal. The private terminals are used for private planes. We don't fly private planes. We fly regional planes, however, they still meet the size requirements to take off and land at private terminals. There are never any lines and they have their own security system. So you can show up 15 minutes before the flight and still make it.

Is this the Private Suite at LAX?

Yes. It usually does. Also at some airports customs is seperate as well.

Reiterating problems in the existing way of doing things is a fairly well known method of getting interest and buy-in from prospective customers, so I think the initial rant might actually be connecting with people.

We just wanted to highlight the way the airline industry currently operates and how bad things are.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com