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Comment by PatientTrades | Hacker News Reader

There is plenty of blame to go around here. However a major cause of this has been the push by the left that college is the only path to success. Trade and vocational schools as well as military service are all great options for young adults who may not know exactly what they want to do with their life right away. Spending 4 years of your life taking on debt, simply because society tells you college is the path to success is wrong. Also, colleges themselves need to be held accountable here. Most universities are sitting on billions in tax free endowments and not using that money in useful ways. How about use some of that money to help offset some of these debts?

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>as well as military service are all great options for young adults

Getting shot at for an education doesn't seem that great. Better off just moving to a better country.

One could essentially sign up to be a librarian (bit of an exaggeration but there are active duty members who work at libraries). Same goes for Coast Guard which doesn’t get deployed in the traditional sense and are more like water police.

Ceteribus paribus, the military provides stable job, income, and a generous scholarship.

The scholarship is roughly $70-$100k depending on school and a monthly housing stipend. For SF area, that stipend is $4.2k/month

Anecdotal, but my mother was a mechanic, my uncle a cryptographer, another uncle was some type of police on base, my cousin is a drone pilot and just sits in an office like building despite technically being involved in combat I suppose. Several former colleagues mostly did admin-type work while enlisted. The last person I know to have actually seen combat was my grandfather in Korea--but he knew what he signed up for and it was fairly deliberate at the time, he had wanted to be like his cousin that had fought on Iwo Jima years prior who was also a volunteer. All used their GI bill to get an education.

My point being, there's tons of military jobs that don't involve violence. For each job that does require violence, dozens more auxiliary positions are required to support that job.

>> my mother was a mechanic, my uncle a cryptographer, another uncle was some type of police on base, my cousin is a drone pilot

They have been fortunate. Obviously, in some conflicts, some people in all of those roles end up in postings where they are in hazardous areas. (Also: IIRC drone pilots stationed far from conflict still experience combat-induced PTSD.)

The other feature of the armed services is that in general, once you enlist you don't always get to choose your posting. It's great that some people get to choose plum jobs away from war zones, but (most?) others don't (and this can change for anyone in the military, at any time). A defining feature of a military is orders, and following them.

Military careers can be rewarding for some people. But just as it's wrong to say college is for everyone, it's not correct to suggest that one can embark on a military career without adding additional personal safety risk.

OP didn't say to join the military to get an education he said to do it as an alternative to college. It's a good career path that teaches useful skills. Most people in the military aren't employed in combat roles.

Uhm.. apparently you have little to no experience with the US military.

This worked out fine for me, no shooting involved: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/35T

There are plenty of jobs more hazardous than "soldier". I believe there's a guy who made a show about such "dirty jobs"? Mining, oil fields, and commercial fishing come to mind.

If by "the left" you also mean every prominent suburban area in America, then yes!

It's right to bring up the military and the trades as viable options, but let's not oversell that stuff. The trades aren't just a shoo-in easy crack at six figures like folks spout off. You gotta work for that master-tradesman slot. It'd probably take you 10+ years to get there if you're good enough. The trades are designed to limit the number of people entering them...it's part of why they make so much money. It's also incredibly hard work and tears up your body as you age.

I think the drawbacks to joining the military are pretty obvious and go without saying.

Huh? http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/09... seems pretty bipartisan.

But I agree trade schools need more respect. The kinds of work taught there is necessary and pays well.

> seems pretty bipartisan

That's 10 years old, plus I wouldn't call those voting numbers overwhelming bipartisan support. It passed, but many Republicans voted against it. All democrats voted for it...

It's a shame you're getting downvoted, since you make good points. For many people the expected value of college is negative. I also think HN is unnecessarily critical of the military. I work with lots of people who served in the military for a few years after high school before eventually going back to college and they seem happy with the decision.

It would be hard to justify serving in the US military in terms of morality, personal risk, and long term health consequences.

Maybe ask the people who've served in it? Most people I know who were in the military don't regret it.

My grandfather served, my father served, a good friend of mine served then died in Iraq, another is still serving.

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