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Comment by kqr | Hacker News Reader

> And the brain mode for 'developer' is VERY different from the brain mode for 'support agent'.

This is something I can have trouble with even personally. I have noticed that when I get home from a long day of cold, analytical problem-solving, I mbrain bad at shifting my brain to empathetically listen and provide emotional support for my wifes problems.

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I wrote myself off as "bad at being supportive" for a long time. Eventually I realized that being supportive is a trainable skill just like software development or healthy eating. I am still not great at it, but getting better. I respectfully urge you to examine yourself and try to modify your habits rather than looking for excuses.

Agreed that it is trainable if you are bad at it in general.

I don't think the parent was saying that he is bad at emotional support and being empathetic. He said he is having trouble switching from the developer brain mode into the empathetic human brain mode.

This is something I noticed myself as well, especially when working from home. When I worked in an office, the commute home provided time to decompress and switch off my focused analytical brain. By the time I would get home, I would be in the proper mindset. I guess you could say that there are benefits to a commute after all!

> I guess you could say that there are benefits to a commute after all!

Absolutely, its forced idle time where your mind can drift. Although, over time, I find myself just getting more and more tired during my commute to the point where anything I do think about is quickly lost now... :/

Maybe, just for the fun of it, take a different route home one day. Even if it is a good few minutes out of the way. A road you haven't been down yet to re-engage your mind and senses as you navigate that new path.

The daily transition from work to home is difficult for many couples and this problem has existed since forever, but it has _nothing_ to do with "being analytical" at work and then having to "be empathetic" at home.

It doesn't matter what your job is or if you're a husband or a wife, there's a period of time after coming home from work that is beset with opportunities for arguments. Lots of people experience this, not just rocket-scientists and developers :-)

There's no sure-fire solution, but a little bit of buffer time seems to work, followed by deliberate accommodation for the needs of the other.

> "it has _nothing_ to do with "being analytical" at work and then having to "be empathetic" at home."

[citation needed]

I doubt you (or anyone, for that matter) can make such a claim with scientific rigor. You are responding to a statement of someone's personal experience - for them, it very well may have something to do with switching from an analytical, critical state to a more empathetic one.

For my part, I recognized after I got married that I was coming home and applying the same mental model I used at work in conversations with my wife: I was there exclusively to solve problems. My wife just wanted me to listen while she told me about her day. This definitely increased the surface area for arguments, because in my years I've found that generally, wives want you to shut up and listen and empathize with what they're complaining about, and not rattling off "answers" to the problems. I did have to train myself to adapt to the transition. It did cause problems specifically because of the mental model I brought home from work.

It took me a long time to get this right too. I came across this amusing page and realized I wasn't a bad person, because there is a lot of truth to this.

specifically, #39:

http://showcase.netins.net/web/tash/rules/rules.html

This page is very silly, it basically says 'men get to do what they want when they want'. I like how the longest rule is about being 'single-minded', which is basically just an excuse for not taking part in all facets of your relationship.

Here is another perspective which you may find equally dumb:

https://english.emmaclit.com/2017/05/20/you-shouldve-asked/

Note that this comic is coming from a totally female perspective (scary!) but it really applies either way. For instance, in my marriage I am the one who feels like the chore-czar, while my wife is the one who tends to feel like the planning-czar. If we both realize this and try to meet in the middle it makes things go a lot more smoothly.

That's cute, but here's a funnier way to say it:

http://www.owensworld.com/jokes/men-women/boyfriend-50-upgra...

I prefer humor, but it's obviously not for everybody. Also theres a slightly different version of the one I posted above on this page, but I couldn't find a directly corresponding one for women's version. If you do please share- I'd like to forward it to my wife.

This is assuming they both want the same thing. Society pushes us into marriage and getting kids, not just into gender roles. I think greater equality will lead to more single people, not more men doing house work. Because people will realize they actually have a choice. Most people don’t want to clean and administer the same stuff every day. And although nobody would prefer that thir kids were never born, people would not feel like they are losing out if they never get kids. Developed countries have people get fewer kids later in their lives. Maybe it is because of the economy, but kids could help their parents with money, so i dont think so, i think it is by choice. You could call it people getting more selfish, i say it is people getting more rational, or «analytical» if you will.

There's a truism about gender: when men complain, it's because they want something solved. When women complain, it's because they want sympathy.

Doesn't mix and match well unless you consciously try to handle it differently.

> My wife just wanted me to listen while she told me about her day...

Yes. Totally this...just listen to her...turn off all that problem solving stuff and just look her in the eyes and keep your mouth shut, no matter what she is saying.

She is strong...she can solve her problems, but she needs you to hear her vent and offer emotional support.

Definitely not claiming "scientific rigor" nor do I think it would be worth it to even try.

The argument-after-work scenario, however, has been around for a long time and is well known by marriage counselors.

https://hbr.org/2016/04/how-to-not-fight-with-your-spouse-wh...

FTA:

> Different needs. Both parties are likely to be in different mental and emotional states with differing sets of personal needs, and while this may seem self-evident, it’s striking how many couples forget this when they walk in the door.

A story from my father:

My mother worked in a psych ward, and would come home stressed. She asked that, every day for the hour after she got home, she not be bothered with anything. She just wanted a break between the (inevitable) difficulties of work life and the (potential) difficulties of home life.

So no, not analytic related and not gender related.

I've found that repeating a little mantra of what to expect of myself exactly at that moment of switching helps. For me that moment is getting out of the car, hungry and with a full head, after a long commute. Diving head first into family life with small children is hard, but they deserve my fullest attention before bed time even before my own needs (food, rest, possibly work some more). Just breathing and repeating that works for me. (Apologies if this goes too far into the spiritual.)

Erm, I would call spiritual something different ...

What you do, is just helpful, applied psychology ;)

edit: spiritual, I would more call, praying to whomever, to fill you with love, before going into your family life ... which can also work, wheter for psychological or divine reasons ...

I've found a short (20 minute) nap can help a lot with this.

I've found that doing anything distracting can help.

Commuting, listening to a podcast or audio book, playing a video game for 15-20 minutes, ...

Whatever takes your mind away from matters at work.

I've found that a short (20 minute) commute can help a lot with this.

I'm actually serious -- the commute is like a palate cleanser between work and home. It helps even more when I ride a motorcycle, as the concentration on my safety totally wipes the coding from my brain, and I walk in the house with a clean slate.

Yeah I've seen some people that work from home mention this - the ritual or transition of going from work to home is something they miss. To a degree of course, I mean 20 minutes isn't too bad, for me it's often more than an hour which is a bit much.

But some people's work continues after the commute. Humanity is untenable; embrace the cold, unempathic autism. It is the only way.

This was the biggest reason I switched from working as a programmer and spent some semesters becoming a high school teacher teaching mathematics and programming. I feel I can be much more available for my (to be) wife and my friends now. (it's paid less oc but I have been lucky and don't need so much).

that's one of the reason I walk home, so I have time to disengage from work. (edit: I also live close-by now, but before it was public transit, for the same reason)

oh, and I thought I was a bad person... interesting that others have the same issue (?)

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