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Comment by ardit33 | Hacker News Reader

Can't read the article because of the paywall. But if you are looking for protein without consuming meat, then usually dairy protein is great.

1) Milk based products that are high on protein (either whey, or casein). Most shakes are usually whey. Otherwise yogurt is a great source (Icelandic skyr is mostly protein). Some cheeses have more protein than fat, etc...

2) Egg protein. Either full eggs, or just whites, or powder egg protein.

3) Peas, Beans, Peanut Butter are good protein sources as well... but you can really eat so much in a day

4) Avoid soy, (for many reasons, but mainly because it is thought to be andrenogenic).

If you can't eat either milk or egg based products and I think you are a bit out of luck. Yes, there are people that manage fine with (there even vegan bodybuilders), but it really becomes tough diet wise as it is very restrictive....

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Here's a mainstream example of how being vegan won't affect your performance. Or make it hard to eat...

https://www.sbnation.com/2017/10/25/16505120/nba-vegan-veget...

That article has me baffled. So many players talking about how much weight they've lost. One of them lost 40 lbs!

In every sport I've ever participated in, the diet dilemma of the top tier athletes is how to keep the weight on...not how to lose it. I don't even know what to say, just that it seems so weird.

It's a modern NBA thing:

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2017/11/4/16593220/nba-weight-...

Just something to consider: professional athletes are just about the worst examples to look toward for diet and fitness pointers. The reason is that pro athletes are genetic freaks, which means they can get away with all sorts of suboptimal behavior and still exhibit incredible performance.

It seems pointless to me when people become "vegetarian" to opt out of the factory farming/animal cruelty machine...only to eat massive amounts of eggs and dairy.

It's a question of degree. One hundred gram of meat vs 200g of yoghurt implies a significantly higher energy use and on average is more crucial pretty calorie.

He's talking about the "factory farming/animal cruelty machine", thus ethics.

You are responding about "energy use", this environmental impact.

Two separate reasons to go vegan. (besides the issues of pollution, scarcity and health-impact)

I also referenced the cruelty? The point being that to get the same amount of energy out of milk/egg based products you'll need fewer animals than for meat based production (where animals have to grow for multiple months to years just to be slaughtered). Which means fewer animals will suffer to feed one person. It's obviously possible to reduce further.

Hard to compare the cruelty involved in breeding-for-slaughter, breeding-for-milking-then-slaughter or breeding-for-egg-laying-then-slaughter. Or to compare suffering in a chicken with the suffering of a cow. How many chicks convert to one cow?

Bottom line is vegan, period. And even that line is blurry if you zoom in enough :)

Just in case you check your replies now and then - yes, you get what I was saying.

One can opt out of meat and meat products for reasons of health (which are complicated and debatable, but a personal choice), reducing environmental impact, and not taking part in the way we currently handle animals for food.

The latter one is complicated, as it is technically possible to opt out of supporting the chicken/cow "matrix" if you really truly only ever eat meat/eggs/dairy from animals that are raised, used, and finally killed on (likely) local farms that generally treat their animals with "dignity" for whatever that's worth until they kill them. I personally don't think that real free range cattle and chickens that are eventually slaughtered have bad lives for what they are - but being able to only eat such animals is definitely a choice only available to the upper-middle class and up, given the current system.

But if you're a vegetarian and you routinely buy 48 egg cartons for $6 at your local safeway and eat tons of cheese? You just have a restrictive weird diet.

Seems reasonable to consider pigs and cows as different from chickens and fish in this case.

Why? Pigs are generally considered intelligent animals.

Cows...not so much, but by that logic, where are we drawing the line?

Well, in one case the animal dies for the calories that you consume and in the other they continue to live. Now, the animals may have a terrible quality of life, but that is a different issue (which also applies to animals who are killed for meat).

Androgenic?

I keep hearing that soy proteins promote estrogen production but I've never found an actual study with significative results proving this. Any sources?

> but I've never found an actual study with significative results proving this.

There aren't any.

Bingo

> There aren't any.

Here a good overview of what we do know:

https://nutritionfacts.org/video/who-shouldnt-eat-soy/

The "bad soy" story originates largely from Kaayla Daniel and has been thoroughly debunked.

http://gofitu.com/food-myths-debunked-great-soy-debate/

Regarding the paywall, it's really annoying. I know journalism isn't free. I have a paid NYT subscription and The Guardian as well, but these companies have to realize that you can't ask people to pay a subscription to every major newspaper in the world. By the same token, I'll pay for streaming but I'm not going to pay for separate streaming services for every corporation out there that wants to build its own streaming service.

There needs to be a service that brings together several major newspapers or streaming services so you can pay one subscription for all of them.

That's why a lot of newspapers ey provide a number of free articles poet month? I'm not a huge fan, but I've yet to see good sustainable models for quality news...

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