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Comment by bfuller | Hacker News Reader

I'm sure this won't be a popular opinion on a website where most people probably make close to 100k but bail would be a lot more fair if it were based on total income.

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Typical bails are so small already that I can't seem to get riled up over this particular "injustice".

An assault and battery charge will generally get you a $10K bail. Assuming the typical bondsman charges 10%, that's a measly $1,000 to be walking the streets again after assaulting someone.

I can already hear the stampede of justice troopers coming to tell me that $1,000 of emergency funds is too much to ask of your average accused criminal. How many of you would be amenable to say, a $100 charge for an ankle bracelet? Or a work-release program that allows them to attend work while waiting for trial?

> again after assaulting someone.

They haven't been to court yet, they might be innocent.

True, but it's more likely they're guilty.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conviction_rate#cite_note-5

oh dear.

the presumption of innocence is an international human right. justice-by-statistics is an extremely bad idea.

At the core of this is the old, philosophical question of, "Is it better to let one hundred criminals go free if it means not wrongfully convicting one innocent man?"

Considering that we are talking about bail (meaning 1-2 weeks in jail, not a lifetime in prison) and we have justice systems that are right 80-90% of the time, I lean towards the more pragmatic statistical approach.

The "internationally recognized human right" thing seems like a thought terminating cliche, not sure why that should be the end of the discussion.

i do not think you understand the reality of someone living, for instance, paycheck-to-paycheck. "1-2 weeks in jail", which you seem to suggest is not that big of a deal, is a lost job and unpaid rent, to say nothing of other responsibilities (for instance, children or pets). does this seem like a reasonable consequence for being merely accused of a crime?

i brought up the human rights angle because your line of thought appears to run counter to article 11 of the UN Declaration of Human Rights...but it's interesting that you can dismiss that by calling it a "cliche".

So what if my thoughts run counter to some UN document? It's interesting that you evoke it in such a religious manner, as if that alone should shut out any discussion.

So what if your thoughts run counter to the universal declaration of human rights? Are you serious?

That's the “Universal Declaration of Human Rights” not “UN Declaration of Human Rights”.

So someone should have to spend 1-2 weeks in jail, thus losing their job, losing their ability to pay rent, so likely losing their house, despite the fact that it has not been proven that they've done anything?

It's not always 1-2 weeks, it can be months.

stampede of justice troopers coming to tell me that $1,000 of emergency funds is too much

The first search result I got back says that median retirement savings are <$500 for youngish people.

That $1k is only "small" for us rich folk.

So, 2 weeks of wage income is a fair price to pay before you even face your accuser?

This post stinks of classism. There are people who have been in jail without trial for 6+ months because they can't afford bail.

In fact your arrogant assertion that this isn't injustice is fucking offensive. I am having trouble not attacking you personally because of how ignorant you came off in this post.

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