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Comment by sillysaurus3 | Hacker News Reader

It's pretty strange that someone lost their livelihood solely because they didn't bow to authority.

(As opposed to a practical reason, like "what he did mattered.")

It seems harmless at first, but...

In the video, we can see an email on his phone marked "restricted" with a project code name and some other details. That could potentially be harmful. His daugher is probably not allowed to see that, let alone post it on youtube.

Not to mention, they want to tightly control the message prior to the pre-order sale... they don't want any unfinished software on the device changing people's opinion and affecting pre-orders unnecessarily.

I saw way more harm in the engineer using the phone to pay for lunch at the cafeteria and mention that he worked on that feature. Was that cashier under the same NDA?

Now he's seen it and can leak the design to the world and nobody would know. Or were there dozens of these prototypes running around the Apple campus and everyone (including contractors and guests) knows to look the other way?

You can be pretty damn sure janitors, cafeteria workers, etc sign NDAs before starting on Apple/Microsoft/etc

But isn't Caffe Macs considered a public area (guests and family visiting for meals, etc)?

If you are someone else’s employee then you are already “bowing to authority” or as I put it working for someone else.

NDAs are serious. If I violated a NDA I would likely be taken to court as well as fired.

Yes. And that's my point: We have no autonomy to decide whether something matters. You don't get to choose.

Unless, of course, you're in a position of power. Then you do.

That kind of cheapens the idea that we're all working to build something great. Situations like this reveal what we're really working for.

> We have no autonomy to decide whether something matters. You don't get to choose.

The choice was made when he signed the NDA. That's literally what signing it means.

What did you expect? You have the choice of refusing to sign and thereby working somewhere else.

Except you don't. No matter where you work, the situation is the same.

Your options are to smile and sign, or start your own company. And the latter isn't practical for most of us.

Basically what you're arguing is that an employer shouldn't be able to require anything of their employees.

What's your ideal solution? I can't imagine a world where employers just let employees do whatever they wanted with trade secrets... am I missing something you're trying to say?

Without sounding like I'm judging here, but can you explain why starting your own company, "isn't practical for most of us"?

Seems to me the overwhelming majority of people are free to make the choice to start their own company. Or, am I missing something...?

What do you mean by: > We have no autonomy to decide whether something matters.

Apple firing him is not him losing his livelihood.

If they cut off his hands, that would be loss of livelihood, but he will probably be able to get another job in the field.

If his reputation is so sullied that he can't get a tech job, well, then that isn't really just on Apple.

A man was let go for allowing a family member to record video of an unreleased device on company property. In onboarding materials, it is extremely clear that this sort of thing will get you fired.

Lost their livelihood? They're not an uninsured flood victim.

Sucks if he really liked his job, but I doubt he'll be out of work long enough to really feel it financially.

It does matter. I work in an industry where any leaks of a new product can make our share price drop or go up - so an employee being careless about what they share online does actually affect the company a lot. I would absolutely be fired if I leaked what product I am working on and I don't see anything wrong with that, it's not about bowing to authority.

Well at least this was for a reason.

Remember that one guy they fired for a bad decorated apartment? You got life a representative lifestyle- so designer cloths, designer furniture- else apple does not want to associated with you. IKEA is very very close to crossing a line there.

> Remember that one guy they fired for a bad decorated apartment?

No. What are you talking about?

Sarcasm folks... GP complained about it being a 'lifestyle' thing.

This doesn’t read like sarcasm to me and the “lifestyle” comment is not in this comment’s parent tree.

Maybe it is sarcasm, but it’s bizarre if so. (Bizarre either way, actually.)

Got a link to that story?

What about it do you find strange? He broke the rules, which he himself signed on he wouldn't, and got fired as a result. As a counter argument 'what does it matter i was drink driving officer? There was no one on the road'

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