Hacker News Reader

Comment by squigg | Hacker News Reader

I'm sorry but you will have to do more to explain your point on black cab user experience being horrendous. Whilst it can be hard to get a hold of one at times, in my experience of 20 years of using them, the user experience is great - the drivers are typically friendly and get you there as quickly as they can. I have used Uber many times in London and abandoned it months ago, as the drivers don't have the local knowledge required to quickly move across what is a very busy city. SatNav isn't everything - give me driver experience every single time.

View on HN

I've had black cab drivers insist that I can't use my card, and that I must get out.

I've had cab drivers refuse to drive me to certain parts of London because it's inconvenient for them.

They are also really expensive.

Pretty much this, and I have only crossed the channel a handful times to visit friends. Same experience in France when trying out legacy taxis, they are supposed to take cards, they display it on their car, yet, some will refuse it and cause trouble if you try using it.

Basically, it comes down to lack of serious customer support and accountability system. Setting new rules from top to bottom in a legacy industry that has decades of industry malpractice under its belt cannot be effective if you aren't able to enforce those rules.

> I've had black cab drivers insist that I can't use my card, and that I must get out. > I've had cab drivers refuse to drive me to certain parts of London because it's inconvenient for them.

Report them, by taxi license number (displayed on a plate in the passenger area). Both those things are rare and taken seriously, but the authorities can't do anything if they aren't told.

Defiantly not rare. And I don't want to spend my evening complaining to tfl.

Then just accept the fact you’re part of the problem. If everyone was like you and only in it for themselves, quality service would be rare, if not ever.

I'm PAYING money in order to get a service to reduce the stress in my life.

I'm not paying money to increase it.

I improve services by voting with my wallet, which black cabs are trying to take away from the consumer.

While the cabbies do hate Uber, I'm not sure you can blame the current moves entirely on them, there's quite a lot more to it than that.

Everybody knows the blackcabs have been lobbying tfl and major for a long time.

Sure, but I don't think you can really blame the black cabs for the ban, there's a lot of substance to the complaints.

No. Switching to a different provider is an excellent response to poor service. And one that definitely incentivizes improvement.

LOL! How about instead of doing that, everyone just uses a service that doesn't suck?

A customer should not HAVE to report people for this shit. It should just work. And if it doesn't, then I am using a different service.

Black Cabs in London are wonderful, except:

1. When you need one at about 10pm in the City, and stand on the street corner for ages watching dozens of them go by with their lights off and no passengers.

2. When you are less than 1/2 a mile north of the Thames, and the cabbie refuses the ride because he 'doesn't go south of the river, mate'

3. Same as #2 but 'doesn't go north of the river, mate'

4. Same as #2 and #3 but for inside/outside the north/south circular ringroad.

5. Deliberately ignoring your route request, and then snarles the cab up in non-moving traffic all while the meter is still running (Black Cabs charge by time, not distance).

In nearly 20 years of relying extensively on black cabs as I don't have a drivers license, I've never experienced a single one of the above.

Sounds like you're exceptionally unlucky.

Let me guess: you're white, male, in your 30s+, and usually in a suit when calling a cab?

Rarely in a suit. The rest, yes, but the same also applies to my black ex, who incidentally also uses taxis far more than me. No doubt there's plenty of racism in the UK, but of all the places she's complained about racist behavior, black cabs has never been of them. Maybe we've just been lucky. Or maybe you've been extremely unlucky.

I think the TfL night bus service is a game changer for a lot of people, you may be waiting for 20 minutes for a connect to what would be zone 5+ but the personal security aspect is pretty good and there are no 'South of the river' games played by bus drivers. I like being under CCTV for my journey when on the night bus.

For me it is not 'let's grab an Uber', it is 'drat, missed the last train, where and when do I get the night bus?'

Because traffic is considerably lighter at night the bus goes at a good speed and during the day the bus has its own lane, one which Uber can't be in.

I appreciate that if you have some very important clients arriving then you want to book them a cab, plus there are plenty of other reasons to get a cab, however, TfL is putting together a transport system for everyone, not just people stuck in their apps.

> (Black Cabs charge by time, not distance).

that's incomplete.

https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/taxis-and-minicabs/taxi-fares/tarif...

> The meter automatically adds a charge based on time for any part of a taxi journey when the speed drops below 10.4mph.

https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/taxis-and-minicabs/taxi-fares

I've had the second (refused to be driven) from Uber drivers in London before, except couched in silly excuses like "there are roadworks, it's not possible", and to add insult to injury, marking the ride as complete so I get charged anyway. TBF Uber were extremely prompt about refunding it.

The last point I won't disagree with; Uber is definitely cheaper, qualitatively so, such that you'd consider it for trips that you'd never take a black cab for.

I've only taken a London cab a handful of times, but I never had a bad experience. I don't think I've had a bad experience with Uber drivers either...maybe one or two weird conversations .. same with Lyft drivers.

I just want to know if Uber drivers can average the same income as cabbies working the same hours. In New Zealand, several Uber drivers use to be cabbies and switched from Wellington Combined because they earned more money with Uber. That was years ago and I'm curious if that's still the case or if those drivers have switched back. In Berlin, the Uber app hails a regular taxi driver that's under standard taxi regulations from the city, so there it's more just a billing system.

Everywhere else I've taken Lyft/Uber, the drivers never started out in taxis. It's turning the taxi industry into a "gig economy" I realize a lot of people got their start in new cities as taxi drivers; immigrants from generations back. Things are changing. It's not good or bad, just different.

The biggest concern is Uber as a company. Most of the rides I've mentioned I've taken with others. I prefer public transport when possible, Lyft when I have to. For a while on HN, ever week was another post: Greyball, the Hell map, the two harassment blog posts, anti-union efforts against drivers, hiring Eric Holder for damage control, the continuing Google/Waymo self driving tech court case, etc.

Are there any recent posts on how much drivers earn? I've heard it's going down each year. Is it worth it to lose an entire career path for some people for cheaper rides?

> I just want to know if Uber drivers can average the same income as cabbies working the same hours.

I have no data, but my prior based on conversations in London is "no way". Uber pays similarly to minicabs --- minimum wage-ish when car maintenance is accounted for. Pre-Uber, I heard cabbies made £40k-£60k pretty steadily.

£50k is more than 90% of the country, its no wonder they hate the competiton.

(I suspect they make £60k but they don't declare anywhere near that)

uber is pretty much useless in zone 1 since the roads are too narrow and the traffic too extreme. you could literally take a leisurely walk from the british museum down to leicester square garden faster than a minicab. black cabs have the benefit of being allowed to travel on bus lanes and that makes all the difference in central London.

that said, black cabs get more and more unreliable the further away from central London you are.

As someone who grew up in zone 4 and has lived for 18 years in zone 6, I don't recognise the last point here at all.

I've been turned away by a black cab driver because they didn't want to go where I wanted to go.

Yes, during the rush hours they are faster than ubers (mostly because they have priviledged access to bus lanes etc). But catching a black cab at night is almost impossible.

Also some of my friends regularly get ignored by black cabs when they try to hail it.

Black cabs need to be kicked out of bus lanes. They should be for mass transport of people, not chauffeuring businessmen from Euston to Canary Wharf quickly.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com