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Comment by einrealist | Hacker News Reader

I cannot get around the missing headphone jack. My headphones cost more than this new iPhone :(

Is the DAC even good enough in the iPhone at that point? Even if you had a straight jack audiophile headphones are probably not getting much benefit over, say, Bose headphones are they?

The internal DAC is good enough when I am on my feet. Its more about stability and convenience than sound quality in this situation. Its inconvenient to carry an additional adapter which gets accidently disconnected more easily than a jack.

I use an external DAC (Beyerdynamic A200p) when I use my notebook or my iPhone stationary.

Edit: I use Shure SE846 as headphones.

Does a DAC even matter? Would love to see blind test showing they make a difference.

Do you know what a DAC is? They "make a difference" by allowing you to analog headphones. So more so "required"...

Yes thread is about quality of DAC not if a DAC is required.

Do headphones even matter after a certain price point? http://asa.scitation.org/doi/10.1121/1.4984044

Headphones sound different. Open air ones, closed, planar etc. Don't all DACs sound the same like amplifiers(unless its a tube)?

Apple's DACs are excellent. Here's an analysis of the Lightning adapter, for instance:

http://www.kenrockwell.com/apple/lightning-adapter-audio-qua...

It wasn't the only reason I switched to a Pixel after 10 iPhone years, but it probably was what made the decision so easy.

Rumors say that Pixel 2 is dropping the jack as well, so it looks like many manufacturers are following suit.

I'd be okay if they removed the headphone jack if the box came with 2x USB-C headphone jack converters (for when I naturally lose the first one). And they sell them everywhere for $5-10 at most.

If I had to go to an Apple store every time I lost my headphones and had to pay $20 for a new converter I'd go crazy. And I heard they don't even come with a free one with new iPhone's? (I could be wrong here)

This is the real core of the problem to me... they have to make legacy support extremely seamless after making an extreme early adopter product transition to wireless headphone tech. At least with the lighting chargers they are everywhere and cheap.

iPhone 7 comes with a pair of Lightning EarPhones and a Lightning to 3.5 mm jack adapter.

Are those the "earpods" or whatever? Since they started making those, I have thought of them as absolute garbage. The sound quality is terrible, they don't block any external audio, they constantly fall out.

Maybe I just have stupid shaped ears or something, but I have always thought as apple-brand "earpods" as gilded shit.

Apologies for the rough language, I just cannot express strongly enough how much I despise those "earbuds."

No, these are the wired headphones with an updated Lightning connector.

> The sound quality is terrible, they don't block any external audio, they constantly fall out.

I think the first two problems stem from the third, namely, they don't fit your ears.

> Maybe I just have stupid shaped ears or something

Yes, that is one issue with these headphones is that they don't seem to fit in everyone's ears. I'm not sure if there's an easy fix for this.

I'm pretty sure some people sell little silicone covers for them, but I can't help but think that just buying headphones that fit would work much better.

Ah, good, found out from the person they got the phone through a third-party and didn't get either of those with it (and didn't know they should have).

Lightning jacks get accidently disconnected more often than 3.5 jacks when I move around. Also the Lightning connector wears out faster because of the stress a cable imposes on it. For instance, the Lightning connector on my iPhone 6S suffers from a defective contact already. The 3.5 headphone connector is fine, even when I use it much more.

I mean, 1) The Apple adapter is $9 and 2) it's not just Apple that sells them. I'm sure they're sold in just as many places, if not more, than would sell a USB-C adapter.

Well, I said I would be okay with it given those conditions... Like any new tech there will always be a transition period where it's more expensive and less accessible, but there are ways to help mitigate that pain which I've seen vendors neglect in the past, so these concerns are not entirely unfounded.

I personally have not used an iPhone recently to have an opinion on how well Apple currently does it.

Plus the 7 came with one in a box, and it seems the 8 and X will also come with one in the box.

Is the sound quality of the lightning to headphone jack adapter inferior to the built-in DAC of previous models?

I’d think the problem is in having to carry an adapter with you all the time, which is easy to forget.

I just left mine plugged into the headphone connector on the headphones. I briefly considered keeping a rubber band on them to tie to adapter to on the rare occasions when I needed to plug it into something else, but it wasn't actually a big issue for me.

Alternatively, they also have bluetooth transmitters that plug into the jack on your headphones now that you can use. But I don't know what the battery life of UI convenience is on those. I switched to the Beats X for listening on my iPhone and have never been happier. The occasional frustration of not charging my headphones pales in comparison to the everyday frustrations of untangling wires all the time.

Disclaimer: I do not own, or use, i Devices, and refuse to buy any laptop > 700€, or phone > 250€.

I personally use my Sennheiser headphones on the PC, but also on the phone, and elsewhere. I got them from my parents when I was young, and, just like my parents used their top-of-the-line sennheiser headphones their entire life, I plan on using mine for the next 60 years, and I’ve got one single set of them.

So leaving an adapter plugged in isn’t optimal, nor is buying new headphones. Because, who are we kidding, in 60 years lightning and USB will be long gone, but 3.5mm Klincke will still exist.

Why don't you just get a set of headphones (https://www.sony.com/electronics/headband-headphones/mdr-1ad...) with a lightning connector and a built in DAC?

Maybe they don't want to spend $400 for specialty headphones that pretty much only work with the iPhone.

Because wireless headphones work with all BT devices and cost hundreds of dollars less.

They are also convenient to use while commuting and while working out, which is basically 95% of my time using headphones with my phone. Ambient noise while walking, riding a bus, or being in a gym is generally too noisy to prioritize audio fidelity anyway. That's not what listening to music on my portable phone is for. I have better headphones for my desk.

It's not even that it's easy to forget, it's that it's annoying. More bulk in my pocket, and now if I want to switch from my phone to my computer I've got to unplug two things instead of one.

No, I don't consider bluetooth to be a great solution, either. I've got more than enough individual things to worry about keeping charged already. It's like the electrical outlet is trying to give birth to a damn squid every evening.

Nope. According to this guy, it's actually slightly better.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/apple/lightning-adapter-audio-qua...

I'm still looking for a place to plug in my expensive 5mb SCSI drive.

The difference, of course, is that while a SCSI drive is out-of-date, a headphone jack is not; it is, in fact, superior in every way to a Bluetooth audio connexion.

The headphone jack isn't superior in the requires-plugging-in-way. It's also analog and therefore lossy.

Audio going to the wireless earbuds will require another round of lossy compression and decompression. And I'm sure we all remember what they said about doing lossy compression and decompression multiple times...

That's going to require a few adapters.

I'm sorry, but if you have headphones of such grade why are you sticking them into phones in the first place? As opposed to something like Astell and Kern offerings?

External DACs are inconvenient when I just walk around. Also the iPhone DACs are good enough when I am mobile. There is almost always noise around me anyway, even if the IEMs are good at isolation.

The reason to buy these expensive headphones is not only sound quality, but build quality. Before I bought better IEMs, normal / cheap in-ear headphones lasted like 3 to 6 months.

You should definitely look into Astell and Kern then. They are mp3 players with their own music service with audiophile-grade outputs.

I think there is already a case you can buy for the previous iPhone which has a headphone jack included.

ditto - I'm fearing dongles in all of our futures.

They're clearly banking on wireless chargers becoming mainstream and ubiquitous, leaving the lightning connector for headphones. The dongle madness seems less mad if you can charge all your doodads with the one watchacallit.

> They're clearly banking on wireless chargers becoming mainstream and ubiquitous, leaving the lightning connector for headphones.

Well, true, but they're also banking on wireless headphones.

Have you tried AirPods? Or the Beats headphones that have the same wireless chip?

I think they might be right. I never cared about wireless headphones until I tried AirPods and there're so incredibly convenient that I use them all the time now.

Now I understand why so many people said wireless headphones were amazing.

> Have you tried AirPods? Or the Beats headphones that have the same wireless chip?

I have not. I like the design, and hate cables, they're just a bit more money than I'd like to spend on headphones right now. When the price drops, I'll check them out.

How's that floppy drive working out for ya?

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