Comment by sjcsjc | Hacker News Reader

Comment by sjcsjc | Hacker News Reader

I posted the following as a reply a few weeks ago, but it might interest some people so I'll re-post it here.

Caveat - this is my interpretation of the various research pieces I've come across. I might be wrong.

It seems that having some period of starvation that is beneficial. Overall calorie intake is less relevant. Decreased overall caloric intake may actually be bad (can't find a link for this at the moment).

Benefits appear to include decreased risk of heart disease, type 2 diabetes and metabolic syndrome, possible decreased cancer risk, and decreased risk of neurological disease. Also longer life expectancy in some animals, as yet unproven in humans.

Even fasting for short periods regularly appears to be beneficial [5]

Three main reasons - autophagy, ketosis and decreased inflammation.

Autophagy, a kind of intracellular recycling operation, is increased by, inter alia, starvation [1]. It seems likely that most of the benefits of fasting derive from this. Valter Longo is a key researcher into this. Of particular interest to me is his work on fasting coupled with chemotherapy. [2]

Ketosis occurs when all your glucose and glycogen (a polymer of glucose) are used up, and you burn fat instead. Mark Mattson is a key researcher into this. Ketosis appears to have a neuroprotective action [3]

Decreased inflammation - chronic inflammation appears to be a cause of all sorts of problems, and fasting appears to decrease it.

[4] is a good general review

[1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2831538/

[2] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3608686/

[3] http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0165017308...

[4] http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1550413113...

[5] http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/861319

Use sci-hub for paywalled papers.

Experimenting with the keto diet for my YouTube endeavors and one thing I didn't expect is how much better my joints would feel.

Prediction: the keto diet will soon come under HEAVY fire from mainstream media, journals, and lobbyist health organizations under the pressure of certain agriculture and pharma groups. Just wait for it.

I'm waiting for that as well. The science gets in the way of profits.

Why would "keto" come under fire now? I'm pretty sure that diet already peaked and is on the decline.

You are right about the trends, but consider this.

The diet became extremely popular in the early 2000's, but among the "fad diet" mainstream population. That peak was unnatural, and most of these dieters will fail at whatever the new diet is because they have unrealistic expectations and don't really follow a disciplined program.

The diet is becoming more popular from a group that has a more scientific approach now.

Also when they diet began to decline there ALREADY WAS a huge push from certain groups to discredit the diet. When Dr. Atkins died he was fat, but this is anecdotal, what is crazy is that his autopsy was released illegally without the families permission.

The whole food industry is based around carbs [especially here in US, where you have corn syrup even in meat]. The dietary recommendations in US are still based around eating low fat [0] instead of massively limiting carbs.

However study after study shows that "keto" and IF (intermittent fasting) is probably the way to go. So now it's a pretty uphill battle. Seems like millennials are pushing for change more quickly and many massive corporations are changing directions, but slowly. So I think we will see a massive dietary change in next 20-30 years, but it's going to be a battle.

[0] https://health.gov/dietaryguidelines/2015/guidelines/executi...

> especially here in US, where you have corn syrup even in meat

What?

> However study after study shows that "keto" and IF (intermittent fasting) is probably the way to go.

Eh, I don't know about that. Some studies indicate that keto helps some people. But like every other diet, adherence is low. And for the most part, the evidence is that what most people need is to just eat a reasonable amount of something approximating real food.

IF is entirely unrelated to keto.

> So I think we will see a massive dietary change in next 20-30 years

I'm extremely doubtful. I'm doubtful we'll even significantly cut the junk intake. I have no expectation that keto will actually become common.

>> especially here in US, where you have corn syrup even in meat > What?

I meant meat products, like sausages, bacon, ...

> And for the most part, the evidence is that what most people need is to just eat a reasonable amount of something approximating real food.

I'm talking about the impact of the diet in overall, e.g. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1325029/

> I have no expectation that keto will actually become common.

I'm not talking about keto but dietary changes overall.

> I meant meat products, like sausages, bacon, ...

So like everywhere else, then? Sugar in cured meats is not exclusively an American phenomenon.

> I'm talking about the impact of the diet in overall, e.g. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1325029/*

I don't really understand your point. The fact that keto helps with diabetes isn't very relevant to a lot of the population.

> I'm not talking about keto but dietary changes overall.*

? The topic was about keto being "under fire".

> So like everywhere else, then? Sugar in cured meats is not exclusively an American phenomenon.

Not exclusively but definitely most prevalent in US

> I don't really understand your point. The fact that keto helps with diabetes isn't very relevant to a lot of the population.

A lot of population, like 10%? [0]. And this is just one of many. It's not only form of help but prevention. Meaning, it's much healthier for people to do keto, than anything else.

> ? The topic was about keto being "under fire".

And I made a comment on overall dietary change. We don't know what a long time on keto will cause, but I believe people are much more eager to experiment and see than they used to.

[0] http://www.diabetes.org/diabetes-basics/statistics/

From what I've seen Keto has started to expand beyond the "diet" label. It's become a universal nutritional description for no low carb, moderate protein, high fat eating, which I and a lot of my friends view as a permanent lifestyle choice (not necessarily inclusive of constant nutritional ketosis), similar to being vegetarian or vegan. When I hear someone describe themselves as a vegetarian I don't think of it as a diet, although I guess there isn't a better word to use to differentiate permanent versus temporary changes to the menu.

You haven't checked Google Trends lately, apparently....

The keto diet, and low-carb diets in general, already are under heavy fire from the mainstream media. Said media often cites government studies funded by said Big Agra / Big Pharma lobbies.

Big Corn is infinitely more powerful than Big Tobacco, and arguably more dangerous.

The AHA coconut oil nonsense is just the start of it.

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