Oh cool! Maybe you can help me here... The part I could not stand about java was getting tied up to an IDE. Every tutorial, book and "experienced" java programmer in college seemed to insist on one (mostly eclipse or netbeans). That just is a strcit no no for me. Btw, this is the same thing that's prevented me from getting on with the whole lisp family of languages. They all ask me to either work in some kind of a sandbox or learn emacs.
I want to get started in a way that allows me to code and ship a hello world program in vim/notepad (ie in a n IDE independent fashion) from day zero. I can handle complexity and steep learning curves. I cannot handle not knowing and fully understanding whatever it is that the IDE is simplifying for me. And I don't want to be treated like a kid. Tell me how to get my hello world app into production the same way people shipping code in that language do as soon as possible. Is there any way for me to shed my java and lisp newbieness?