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Comment by scj | Hacker News Reader

"Silicon Valley venture firms are hustling to Toronto, Waterloo, Montreal and Vancouver to invest in Canadian startups."

What is the Montreal tech scene like for an Anglophone?

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Very very fun.

You don't get paid like an ultra rockstar that lives in a different strata of society than other people, but it being Montreal where rent is affordable and events like the International Jazz Fest, Tam Tams, or drinking wine in one of the many parks is free, and you move all over the island with high quality public transport, it's for the better.

However, it feels a little bit hollow sometimes and like not a lot of real tech work is being done. Lots of stuff geared towards yuppies and going to coffee shops and renting pads and shopping, not a lot of really groundbreaking stuff.

There's gaming companies (eg: Ubisoft), old ex-startups (eg: Shopify), new startups (eg: Transit), Google and Microsoft have offices here, big investment into machine learning research in local universities, etc. It's a college town... for 5 universities... in the downtown of a great city.

There's probably better places to go if you want a super prestige-track career, but I doubt there's many places that are more fun or better balanced.

Though it should be noted that Quebec has much stricter immigration rules than most of Canada.

To elaborate, Quebec has additional requirements to verify your ability to integrate into society. Here's an article that explains some of the differences:

http://correresmidestino.com/immigrating-to-quebec-still-wor...

Can you explain this?

I'm Canadian and unless I'm missing something, or just really don't understand our immigration policies, once you are in Canada you can move where ever you want.

I mean provinces, including Quebec, should have absolutely zero say as to if you can live in them once you are in Canada.

Once you get permanent citizenship, yes. However that takes a couple of years to obtain, and meanwhile there are pretty severe requirements.

(I know a few people who have immigrated but I have no direct experience with specific policies)

Permanent residency*, which is a lot quicker to get than citizenship.

It's been a long time since I looked at this, but IIRC under some visas the federal system gives you extra points for selecting certain provinces. The rationale is that otherwise every immigrant will choose Toronto or Vancouver. Under those visas, you have to be resident in the province you picked for a certain amount of time (again IIRC I think is was 1 year) as a condition of your visa. Quebec is one of the provinces where you can get extra points to get in, but only if you satisfy the Quebec requirements (which generally means French language skill or agreeing to take French language classes, I think).

Disclaimer: when I say it's been a long time since I looked at this, I'm talking 20 years or so. Things have probably changed (or I have misremembered). But it gives you some idea anyway. In my recollection, if you choose not to get extra points for selecting special regions to settle in, then you can settle anywhere you like. Programmers, doctors, nurses etc almost never need the extra points, so it's kind of moot in this discussion.

I don't know but suspect this is no longer the case, Quebec still offers the ability to more or less buy citizenship, even though the federal program was shut down. All you have to do is say you "intend to" settle in Quebec (wink wink) - they get the financial benefits, and the majority of the participants immediately move to Toronto or Vancouver, typically buying a few houses upon arrival as a store of cash. Of course, this is all "speculation", as the Canadian government deems the statistics on this sort of thing to be none of the business of citizens, who are the ones who experience the positive or negative consequences.

http://www.investorimmigrationcanada.com/

But provinces can sponsor people for immigration. I heard that Quebec is an easy way into Canada for French speakers, even if they don't want to live in Quebec.

You mostly just need the additional CSQ form to fill.

I can vouch that it is a very fun place to live; espcially compared to other Canadian cities (I've lived in 4 major cities so far coast-to-coast).

One of the best thing in Quebec is that you can buy booze in any corner groceries! And even that store will have better selection than monopolistic backwaters like Toronto/Vancouver.

Re: 'prestige' companies, Element AI seems to be becoming quite a good place. It just got a massive VC funding of C$120+ mln, and Yoshua Bengio is one of the backers!!!

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14557008

edit: typo + link.

Beer is usually cheap, yes. However for wine and spirits you have to go to the SAQ, where some products have really bad pricing.

FYI, you don't live like a rockstar in SV with your pay. You can buy more gadgets/vacations and afford an ok apartment. If your dual income you can afford a house! It's pretty much like new york.

That Montreal winter tho...

Most productive time of year. Can't physically go outside, nothing to do but code in the Montreal winters.

Why would anyone want that?

Difficult weather makes people bond with each other more. Adversity creates community.

Except for the extreme dryness, the mandatory change of shoes at the office (and getting there except if it's near a metro station)

Give us (TandemLaunch) a ring if you want to do "real tech". We admittedly don't spend much time in the coffee shops, but we most certainly do about as deeply technical work as you are going to find anywhere. Hundreds of people working on world-class problems in AI, CV, robotics, sensors, etc. in collaboration with dozens of top universities across the globe. You won't be disappointed :)

I'm from the area, not even in the city itself, and we have no issues with Anglophones at all.

You are expected to at least try to learn french, we are a bilingual bunch and expect others to be, but nobody has any issues switching to english to talk with the Anglophone coworkers.

What is the point of expecting people to be bilingual? Is it not more efficient to standardize on one language?

because, as the Quebec license plate reads, "je me souviens" (what they did).

By law French comes first in Quebec, from education, to store front signs (French 2X as large and taking center stage relative to English words), to "moving day" (July 1st is technically Canada Day), to provincal holidays, etc.

Makes sense, a few million Francophones hemmed in by hundreds of millions of Anglophones -- in order to preserve the language and culture measures need to be taken to ensure that future generations carry on the fleur-de-lis.

Je me souviens/ Que né sous le lys/ Je croîs sous la rose.

I remember/ That born under the lily/ I grow under the rose.

Thanks, you'll get varying responses depending on who you ask. It's definitely subject to interpretation and has probably held different meanings over time.

The quoted line prompted me to check out the wiki page on the phrase[1], interesting.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Je_me_souviens

That one language, in Quebec, would be French, so.... be careful what you ask for.

Is French as the language of common exchange something to be scared of?

Pretty good I think. I know many anglophones who have lived in Montreal for years, do not speak French, and get by fine.

I agree. That has been my experience...

It's actually astonishing how people who've lived in urban Montreal for over a decade speak almost zero French.

Correct, some don't make any effort (they should, come on)

I dont have experience working in Montreal(only spent a summer there few years ago), but it shouldn't be too hard as an Anglophone. Its a fairly cosmopolitan city.

I'll be happy to answer any queries re: Vancouver/Toronto - which I have direct live/work experiences.

If you make an effort people will welcome you with open arms :) Montreal is lovely.

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