The rise of the QR code in China | Hacker News Reader

The rise of the QR code in China

scmp.com

58 pointskawera19 comments

Chinese users can't afford phones with NFC and more importantly shop owners can't afford NFC POS terminals or for what's worth any terminal for your contactless bank card (Visa paywave/MC Paypass).

Thus they resorted to QR codes, which are now promoted as something modern etc. in these propaganda pieces similar to WeChat propaganda (which usually fail to mention that pretty much all int competitors were blocked or would be blocked if they would start gaining any traction + your wall posts and even private messages are censored if they contain sensitive keywords, of course no encryption, no SMS, etc).

Meanwhile in west I am pretty much forgetting my PIN because I can pay almost everywhere with wireless debit card just by touching terminal without preparing some application in mobile which must be charged, entering PIN code to unlock app, scanning/providing QR code and confirming, soo convenient those QR codes... And lets not forget if there are people in front of you who are just preparing when they should be already paying, which makes everything slower than cash (real life experience from China).

Was living in China for years, you can consider Wechat payments convenient only if you are Chinese who never used contactless bank card like Visa Paywave/MC Paypass available at majority of shops.

Plus on top of this these mobile payments are widespread because chinese online banking is horrific and you can't use it on computer without installing certificates, special USB dongle, etc. while in west it just works in browser without anything.

Is the horrible usability of Chinese bank websites due to the awful security situation on desktop Windows, or it's it for some other reason?

I have no idea to be honest, I remember with all of my bank accounts I would have to download software and use a USB dongle just to login as the OP said. I think it's partly because of how awful the security on Chinese websites is, but no idea really.

That's interesting. I was thinking that perhaps the usability of WeChat for banking is partly due to the lack of pervasive keylogging and remote access tool malware on Android that exists on Windows. All those security threats may be the reason desktop banking requires all the dongles and such.

i would think it's both, horrible security situation on desktop machines plus old attitude to build websites usually not supported in modern browsers (mostly IE only), but in general Chinese websites are extremely heavy on browser, not optimized with very dense layout

don't get me started on official monopoly railways website for selling tickets, straight outta 90s

though TBH Amazon website is also straight from 90s and it's hard to find even in China major shipping site which would look more dated

Also lived in China for a few years, and all of this is definitely true. Quite often I would be stood in line waiting while people try and load their QR codes on WeChat with their awful internet, and then after scanning the QR code have to wait while the person confirms the payment went through. Most of the time it would've been 10x quicker to just use cash. For them it may seem convenient as they've never experienced contactless bank cards, and they don't particularly care about the other people in the queue.

One thing to remember is that Chinese banks are seriously shit. The mobile app is terrible. You need to install software just to login online. You struggle even making domestic transfers. You can't pay for anything online unless you have a credit card. And going into a bank in person has to be one of the worst experiences you can have; you'll be there for at least an hour, and most likely the person you speak to has to ask their manager at every opportunity which form to go and get for you.

Damn it sucks, so no it's no surprise things like WeChat pay are a success in China.

TBH you can use Chinese unionpay cards to pay things online on Chinese websites just fine, but they are not supported abroad and even if you have debit Visa card it won't work on international websites making it pretty much useless, so for international websites you have to use credit card (pretty much impossible to get for foreigner)

actually online banking ain't that bad, I was doing domestic, forex and international transfers just fine, the login part and verification is the most annoying plus support for modern browsers. i would recommend to use BoC which has own RSA keygen on keychain and requires to install only certificate, CMB worked with SMS verification is you used mobile website but for normal banking you had to install their proprietary app. you rarely have to go to bank if you know what you are doing

On the other hand qr code a fantastic to connect non numetic material to the numerical world. I wish it was installed by default on every phone. I wish every street sign, ever document including bills and receipts and and all wrappers were legally binded to expose data using qr code.

what you are asking for is not QR code but advanced OCR, not sure why should we adapt to technology instead vice versa

Advanced OCR hasn't been working properly for years. It still no working now, and it doesn't solve the problem of providing context.

The QR code works, right now. It's reliable. And the context can be provided in a JSON inside it. No need to guess it. It can use standards data schemas, URIs, and are still work with bad ligth.

Switzerland plans to switch to payment slips with QR codes based on the ISO 20022 standard. I wonder whether the QR codes in china also use this standard? Or is this something completely different?

That standard is much more than just the QR code. It describes how transaction data should be handled in europe.

The swiss QR code is a normal QR code, just the data in it has a special format (and also the design of the QR). https://www.iso-20022.ch/lexikon/qr-rechnung/

Slightly off topic but one thing I never understood was how they're able to add additional art to their QR codes and still have phones successfully read and decrypt the code. Are there parts of the code that don't actually provde any value and can be replaced? Or do they use a modified protocol that enables them to use custom QR codes?

QR codes have error correction that can be set to four levels (http://www.qrcode.com/en/about/error_correction.html). If you set the level high enough, you can cover parts of the code and it will still be readable.

QR codes contain error correction bits. Depending on the error correction level up to 30% of the information can be restored. This allows you to add overlays that conceal some of the information while the code will still scan correctly.

See https://research.swtch.com/qart by Russ Cox

Very cool. Does anyone have more technical info on what exactly is embedded in these payment QR codes?

Code relies on payment app, Alipay, Wechat. It embeds the minimal info that shall be sent to those App to continue the payment process. It could be a simple URL. I see that everywhere and feel sick of it. Like white pollution everywhere on electric line poles and bus stops.

The beggar shown links to a personalised url on qq.com which redirects me to wechat

Reply on news.ycombinator.com