Carnegie Mellon Offers New Master's Degree in Product Management

Good question, it really depends on what you want to do in your career.

If you search for "CMU CS Master's", you will end up here: https://www.cs.cmu.edu/masters-programs . We have 26 options for master's programs, ranging from machine learning, human computer interaction, language technologies, robotics, and more.

The high order bit here is that our Master's of Product Management is focused on the combination of business, tech, and UX with an eye towards jobs in managing the strategy, design, implementation, and rollout of products and services. In contrast, most other CS master's programs focus entirely on strengthening your portfolio of technical skills.

Not having an undergrad degree in CS would not disqualify you. We are looking primarily for people with strong tech skills, for several reasons.

When we talked to companies and alums of our other programs who are now product managers, they mentioned that the vast majority of product managers came from engineering backgrounds. This is necessary for leading teams of engineers, to understand how products work, what the tradeoffs are, and where trends are going. It's also very useful for additional credibility with respect to the engineers.

Our Master's of Product Management (MSPM) also requires students to take a technical elective in computer science, e.g. cloud computing, parallel computing, machine learning, networking, etc. We want our students to have technical depth too, since that will help with the above as well as making students better at charting out potential business opportunities.

The main advantages of this program over an MBA are that it is 1 year (instead of 2), it offers more technical depth in CS than MBA programs, and it also brings in a strong component of user experience design. This latter part of UX is something that many of our alums commented on as being important for products and for product managers. Other advantages (though it depends on which MBA track one chooses) are courses in managing people (incentives, motivations, negotiation), high tech marketing, basics of data science, and a capstone course focused on putting those skills together.

With respect to recognition, it's a tough question to answer since it is a new program. One main advantage here is the reputation of CMU's School of Computer Science and the Tepper School of Business. We also have strong industry ties and an active Career Opportunities Center to help students find good jobs.

This is the part I'm the most confused about with this program. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I don't think this part of PM can be taught. The lessons learned from interacting with designers and engineers is something only experience can grant you, and a lot of that typically comes from being a designer or engineer yourself prior to getting into PM full-time.

Currently no scholarship options. This is something we will revisit as the program gets larger.

We do have a staff member who can assist with financial aid. Given current projections of salary for product managers and likely high placement rates, I think that this would still be a good option, but that's also a personal decision that you would have to make.

Thanks, much appreciated!

We talked to a lot of companies and alums before rolling out this program, and there was uniform agreement that industry really needs a lot more (good) product managers.

One further observation was that Google, Facebook, Yelp, and likely other companies had their own internal programs for training product managers, in large part because of a mismatch in supply and demand.

So we believe that placement will be good and in high demand at prominent tech companies.

In terms of comparing the Master's of Product Management (MSPM) to MBAs, that's hard to say at this point. One of the big differences is that the MSPM has a stronger component in UX design and computer science than a typical MBA. It would also depend on what areas of business you specialize in your MBA, e.g. finance and marketing graduates would likely be viewed very differently from the MSPM graduates.

Good points, it turns out that $65k is lower than many of our other master's programs. We also ran through the numbers and that tuition x #students doesn't cover much more than our basic costs. We are a non-profit after all, and one that has a very strong track record in its educational program.

What you're telling us is actually very well aligned with what we've heard from our alums and from some companies. Yes, product managers are not CEOs and can't always just tell people what to do. Product managers work with their direct team (typically some engineers, QA, 1-2 UX designers, possibly a data scientist), but also need to know how to interface with marketing, sales, and others. Part of our curriculum looks at how to work with and positively influence others to achieve desired goals. But you're right, that's not easy, though there are some strategies and tactics that work better than others.

As someone who attended CMU for an MBA and took product management courses in the SCS, it's likely worth it. The classes I took from SCS around use-case driven design, project management of software projects, and platform strategy were some of the most directly-applicable classes in the entire MBA program.

By way of comparison, I think an MBA from CMU runs somewhere > $110k these days. It is one of the most expensive schools in the country (largely due to its until-recently-non-existent endowment; a rarity among top private schools). Hopefully once the settlement with Maxtor shakes out the school will end up with a healthy endowment (I know they're not getting all $10B but $2B would be a nice start for an endowment).

Also, I reject the statement that as a product manager you have no control over the resources. In a product-focused matrix organization, the product manager is ideally responsible for P&L over the product, which means they absolutely do get control over budget. Product management has changed a lot over the last 10 years, and what used to be a powerless position that was a glorified business analyst is now getting budget and control as tech companies reorganize themselves to look like CPGs.

Looking over your program at Utrecht, it feels like the Business Informatics program is more geared towards general business processes with respect to technologies. The closest course at Utrecht to what we're envision with the Master's of Product Management is your Software Product Management elective.

It also seems like the expected roles for people coming out of your program would be general kinds of managers, consultants, or researchers.

There's also a certain underlying style and set of assumptions in the coursework in your program that, for lack of a better term, is European. Have you noticed that in the US that computer science theory usually means complexity theory, but in Europe, it often means automata theory? Sort of the same thing here. There's a strong emphasis in your program on knowledge networks, methods and processes, and so on. It's not that one is better than the other, it's just very different underlying assumptions and starting points for a curriculum.

Currently no plans for a MOOC.

MOOCs have a less-than-positive view at CMU, in part because the evidence is strongly mixed as to their effectiveness in practice. One thing I've learned after being at CMU for many years is that people across the board here really care a lot about empirical evidence.

A MOOC would also make it hard to teach interpersonal skills, as well as assemble a cohort that can learn from each other.

I imagine this is intended for large companies that have hundreds or thousands of employees. Product manager is a specialized role that incorporates strategy and business development. I'm sure startup experience would be great too, but this is different. Product Management often targets projects with multi-year contracts whose lifetime span careers.

Good question, and it's a personal decision as to what a person believes their best path is.

Speaking as someone who has co-founded a successful company (Wombat Security Technologies, over a thousand customers for our security training software), I really didn't know what I didn't know. As an undergrad and a PhD student in CS, I learned tons about graphics, distributed systems, hardware, algorithms, and so on. But that didn't prepare me to read balance sheets, understand how to do a good competitive analysis, know how to manage people, know the best methods for rapidly prototyping and validating ideas, how to do sales and marketing and (more importantly) how to measure it, and so on.

Just on this last point, like most techies, I originally had a negative view of sales and marketing. I never realized how hard it was, how good you have to be at it, and that it can actually be measured in useful ways. If you're lucky enough to be part of a good team that can teach you these and other skills, that's really fantastic.

Now, our Master's of Product Management won't teach you all of the skills above, but it covers many of them. It also does it in a safe space where it's ok to try out ideas, take risks, and fail. You can do it without having to worry about making payroll (though of course there is tuition), or having to find space to lease, or figuring out founder's pies, or worrying about lots of other logistics and paperwork.

That is, at a startup, you are focused solely on one thing: survival. You don't have a lot of time for reflection, for deep thinking, for understanding what are best practices backed by lots of empirical evidence. Like I had when doing my startup, you might also have a narrow view of things because you simply don't know what you don't know. You don't know what other options are possible. And making too many mistakes can be fatal for a startup, resulting in bad feelings from your co-founders and funders.

Now obviously no single master's program can address all of that, or even guarantee success. These are just very different paths for learning, with lots of different goals and tradeoffs.

It's also worth pointing out that startups are not for everyone. Some people might be at a large company and want to make a career change, but still want to stay at a large company. Again, different goals and different tradeoffs.

I know that some public universities have this conflict, in terms of wanting to serve their mission of helping in-state students, but also needing more money to do so (ie foreign students can never be in-state, so they always pay full tuition). It's a bad bind because of decreasing state funds spent on universities. My friends and I often talk about how many public universities get so little from their respective states that they are essentially private universities but are still constrained by their state legislatures. In contrast, private universities don't have as strong an incentive to accept more foreign students.

Anyways, that's a digression.

The short answer is that we are keeping standards very high for admissions for this program. Also, having been in academia for many years, I can easily say that there are lots of brilliant people from all over the world.

I think the success will depend largely on what H1B reforms are brought in and if taking the academic (MS) first will be of continued benefit (as it currently is). Personally I think this is one of the better options vs the body shop route. And there are plenty of smart qualified people around the world as well.

No, but there is a Master's of Software Management (MSM) there that might fit your needs.

http://www.cmu.edu/silicon-valley/academics/software-managem...

Some of the differences are that the Master's of Product Management (MSPM) has a much stronger emphasis on HCI and User Experience Design, and is on a different cycle. That is, the MSPM runs from January to December (1 full year, off cycle), whereas the Master's of Software Management is on the regular cycle. The MSM is also available for part-time students. Lastly, the MSM has a stronger focus on being an engineering manager, though there will be some overlap with being a product manager.

It's a good combo, sure. But a CS degree is way too theoretical. Hands on experience for a leadership role is still going to be preferred. I want to hire a leader who can tell people on their team, "Hey, when I was in this situation a few years back... here's how we handled it... here's what went well, here's what didn't..."

For anyone, I think getting an MBA straight out of undergrad sort of sets you up to be perpetually useless -- a stuffed shirt. You never get the hands-on experience doing the work you are supposed to be leading. Then you have to learn how to manage the work on the job, and as the old saying goes, "Months of dev work can save hours of planning!"

No question, I'd advise people to get hands-on experience if they want to be a leader.

That's about the best compliment I can think of, thanks!

Worse than just trying to Google for the answers are the Product Managers who come over from Marketing and tend to just make up answers. Ha! You have to go over with them the whole notion of compromise, and how just because it's on a Gantt Chart, doesn't mean we want to commit to all the dates for all the features 6 months out... Perpetual compromise, stuff is going to come up, we adapt and reprioritize and if we're lucky (and a good bit of it is luck) then the wheels don't come off the car while we're driving.

> What are they going to teach you that you can't learn on the job?

How to solve common problems of the job without ending a complete wreck? Or sinking the project? Or having to overwork the whole team to compensate for your lack of preparation?

Real world experience is great, but it is always better for you and your environment if you at least try not to make the same mistakes as your predecessors.

My experience is that it is a nightmare to hire product managers who will "figure it out as they go". There are so many skills that a talented product manager needs to be successful. Leadership, communication, technical expertise, and so on are all mentioned in the announcement.

The cost of engineering makes product missteps extremely expensive over time in both the large and the small.

In addition to what others said, there is no guarantee working at a startup is going to give you broad exposure to all the skills you will need later. A well designed and delivered program can do this.

Some grad programs similar to this one also lead up to a capstone course that brings previous students back and gets them exposed to new graduates. This greatly improves exposure and success.

Thats awesome! I hope the leadership for the product development curriculum stays as that makes Cornell Tech a really unique experience. They do an amazing job getting companies from all over NYC to advise on our product projects.

Also a side note, I would love to hear about your experience as a PM in the VR industry, as I am both passionate about developing Augmented Reality products and looking for opportunities to break into the VR industry!

Not a lot unfortunately :(. Cornell Tech organizes a two week trip to the Technion where we interact with various departments, students, and the Israeli startup scene, but they always ask for feedback on how we would like to interact with Technion better.

Also, I've seen some students from Cornell Tech do research internship at the Technion and several Technion appointed professors are lecturers at Cornell Tech.

It would be great to hear any suggestions you have on how you and other students at the Technion would want to collaborate/interact and I can pass it along to the dean of the school. Cornell Tech is really great about listening to the feedback of the students!

Like you said: Courses are easy to replicate; environment is not.

Do you think the connections and opportunities in CMU program are better than the connections and opportunities in a YC startup? If you don't, then I suggest you can just jump in a YC startup then learn something REAL.

Sure it depends on the startup, I agree it will be a totally different game. But the REAL WORLD experience is unbeatable.

If you wanna be a product guy:

8hours of full time job experience at a startup > 8 hours of full time learning every day in Master program of PM

Yeah HBS/Stanford MBA won't make you a good PM. Even doing a Marketing/Engineering/Product intern at an early stage YC startup is much worth it.

Unless some people wanna have a title like"Stanford MBA dropout",then that's a different story and I respect that.

These universities are accredited so they are hardly a scam.

I think the ROI here is going to be a lot better. It's a masters from one of the most prestigious schools in the country.

> Way more cheaper than some fly-by-night coding "academy" which charge 35K$ for 4 months

Comparing an overpriced thing to a really overpriced thing doesn't change the fact that they're both overpriced

PMs at established tech companies can make $200k+ in salary and usually have extra massive stock options to boot. An Amazon PM averages something like $600k/year if they stick around for 5 years.

your daddy or mommy pays for it because they want you to get a job.

I'm paid to do my master's degree and it's still expensive. The difference between the job I left and my pay as a student is about $70k/year. Choosing to do my degree has left me roughly $200k poorer than I otherwise would have been.

I doubt it will ever be a net positive financially. It's worth it to me personally, though.

I could easily forsee being able to make $10,000 extra per year with this credential, probably a lot more. After 6.5 years this would've paid for itself financially. Maybe this is one of the reasons US jobs pay more (at least software product focused ones like software engineer, product manager, designer etc) than in European countries.

That's exactly what I did. Watch PMs in action at your current company, take notes, get interested, and wait for a position to open up internally.

Total price for this new masters would be above the listing price, after housing and other things are factored in. Good MBA can be had for 25k.