Magic Leap Settling Sex Discrimination Lawsuit with Former Employee | Hacker News Reader

Magic Leap Settling Sex Discrimination Lawsuit with Former Employee

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“In IT we have a saying; stay away from the Three Os: Orientals, Old People and Ovaries.”

In 17 years of working IT, I have never heard this saying and nothing even close.

FWIW, if the IT folks I know actually followed this "saying", it would eliminate 80% of the department.

So haven't I and boy am I glad. There seems to be a self selecting bro culture bubble.

It's an old joke about driving, not IT. The guy was just trying to be funny, I guess.

That makes more sense, actually. I haven't heard a person use the term "Oriental" for a group of people in several decades. Makes sense that it's from an old (and stupid) joke.

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Five%20O%27s...

"three Os" sounds better than "one A and two Os"...

I work in IT and my boss uses it with embarrassingly regular frequency... he is in his mid 50s.

Much more common outside the US, where it's not seen as a slur at all. It's commonly used to differentiate the "Far East" (China, Japan, etc) from the rest of Asia (India, etc).

It does technically mean "from the east", after all.

But yeah, you'll see it everywhere in the U.K. for example

Have you worked IT in Florida?

I'm from Florida, worked in tech there, have never heard this phrase and I'd expect anyone using it on the clock to be dressed down pretty severely.

Same, and I started under a guy who held nothing sacred and could swear paint off the walls.

Here in everywhere else we have a saying: "Stay away from Early Termination, Extra-Terrestrials, and Euen Thompson of Magic Leap."

And Entertainment Tonight busses.

http://www.etonline.com/news/199902_donald_trump_and_billy_b...

I would report anyone that said that to HR.

I guess if your only metric is what people are willing to say in front of you then it probably works but you know what they say about metrics...

In general, going for the passive aggressive nuclear option and involving some external authority as your first step is almost never* the right thing to do if you want to actually solve the problem.

In the context of things that shouldn't be said in the workplace doing that creates distrust that prevents people from speaking freely which inevitably works its way into everywhere and affects performance.

*ignoring edge cases.

If someone hasn't realized by now that saying something like that is unacceptable, I have to call into question their critical thinking skills.

On some level it's hard to believe that people say things like this, especially out loud and with women present.

(But I do believe it)

A recent 60 Minutes episode focused on employees in IT that were replaced H1-B Visa contractors. What the reporter failed to notice, or mention, is that every terminated employee was over 50 (my estimate based on appearance).

From the complaint:

> ... the “Wizards Wanted” section of its website. Indeed, given that a “wizard” generally is defined as “a man who has magical powers,” and virtually without exception images of wizards are male, Magic Leap’s recruiting verbiage contains a not-so-subtle “women-need-not-apply” message.

Ummm... technically there is an equivalent 'typically female' term for a woman with magical powers.

I think Magic Leap would still be in trouble if they had used that term in their recruiting literature.

Objection your honor, the sevent-daughter-of-a-seventh-son can be a wizard, thus i demand the charge be dropped based upon precedence of Terry Pratchet vs Gender Stereotypes. I rest my case.

I too support Equal Rites for all but a minor correction. Pratchett specifies that it is the eighth child of an eighth son, not seventh.

This stackexchange entry (https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/182876/why-are-f...) is interesting re: this subject. Basically, the accepted answer asserts that treating 'witch' as a female wizard is a Harry Potterism and that the corresponding male term for witch is warlock.

Another answer suggests 'wizardess' may be the better female term for wizard.

At least in tech we use the same terms for both male and female programmers :)

Or better yet let's all decide as a society that a wizard can be any gender.

> Ummm... technically there is an equivalent 'typically female' term for a woman with magical powers.

"Sorceress"?

"Magician"? Works for all genders, too!

"Magician" is gender-neutral and ideal, but not "typically female".

Unfortunately "Magician" doesn't sound like a person you would want messing around in your code base, though.

The company has "magic" in its name, I think they get a pass.

witch. wizardess? sorceress is born with powers, without the need for historical documents slash knowledge or training and practice. they can coast through life.

Did you just assume that there are only two genders?

Should've just gone with Mage.

"Digital Witches and Wizards wanted" has a Harry Potter ring to it.

Magician, Mage, Conjuror, Illusionist, Phosphomancer are all gender neutral.

Anything is gender neutral if we decide it's gender neutral.

Not quite. It's when we agree it's gender neutral. Good luck with your multi-decade quest to change the accepted meaning and connotations of relatively common words in the English language.

It's really not equivalent if you wouldn't call someone that to their face.

"Magic Leap is probably one of the most secretive technology companies of our generation"??! It's no secret that they're a fraud. That cat's out of the bag.

I mean, come on: just watch Rony Abovitz's TEDxSarasota talk [1] that he so fittingly presented at the Ringling College of Art & Design [2], whose trademarked mission phrase is "Shattering the myth of the starving artist.™".

Yes, those very same Ringling brothers [3], whose colleague P. T. Barnum said: "There's a sucker born every minute." Send in the clowns.

Charlatans like these give the rest of the industry a terrible name.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8J5BWL8oJY

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ringling_College_of_Art_and_De...

[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ringling_Bros._and_Barnum_%26_...

The Ringling College of Art and Design is a reputable design school. Doesn't have much to do with clowns or PT Barnum.

In my mind, they're not as reputable after having given Rony Abovitz a platform to perform that "fudge". Just watch the video, if you can stomach it, all the way through. And read the comments, like this one:

----

Nick Steele 2 years ago (edited)

This is a joke. Take it for what it is. They didn't want to say anything so they basically said "are you ready? READY? ... fuck you".

After a completely ridiculous intro which includes nano machines humping blood cells and two crack monkeys worshiping a massive block of "demented space fudge" which takes up 75% of the talk until 4:30, right after 30 seconds of literal silence, a spaceman says "greetings" and introduces today's "keyword" which is "fudge", then a guy plays terrible music out of tune and sings half-way into the mic. Then the lights suddenly go out and the crack moneys and space man simply walk away.

Keep in mind the audience thinks they are about to hear a billionaire explain his new "world changing" virtual/augmented reality technology, then they get this shit.

The best part is the audiences reaction at the end. :)

----

And if that's not enough proof that Magic Leap is a fraud, then watch their completely fake demo, that they originally did not truthfully bill as a "concept video" but instead they falsely and deceptively titled it "Just another day in the office at Magic Leap" and described it with the blatantly false claim that "This is a game we’re playing around the office right now". But since then, the title and description have been retroactively amended, AFTER they got busted.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPMHcanq0xM

https://www.theverge.com/2016/12/8/13894000/magic-leap-ar-mi...

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/12/09/magic_leap_neither_...

https://www.slashgear.com/magic-leap-video-may-have-involved...

http://www.techspot.com/news/67342-reality-magic-leap-fake-d...

https://www.theverge.com/2016/12/8/13894000/magic-leap-ar-mi...

http://time.com/3752343/magic-leap-video/

----

That last Time article above was written BEFORE they got busted, and it cites a Magic Leap company spokesman (and I'm pretty sure it was a man) mendaciously lying to the rightfully skeptical (and eventually vindicated) Time reporter:

It's unclear whether the video shows an actual game overlaid onto a real-world office space or just an artistic rendering of what the game might look like in the future. The way the gun rests so realistically in the gamer's hand certainly raises suspicions. Still, a company spokesperson confirmed to Gizmodo that the video was authentic.

"This is a game we’re playing around the office right now," Magic Leap wrote on its official YouTube account.

----

The game they were playing (and still are) is called FRAUD.

No evidence P.T. Barnum ever said that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There%27s_a_sucker_born_every_...

Guess the unfortunate thing about trying to solve big problems* with the Silicon Valley startup model is that the pressure to get disruptive overnight to satisfy VC ROI expectations is that you get companies like this or Theranos that promise groundbreaking advances and do them in complete Apple-like secrecy without oversight.

* https://www.technologyreview.com/s/429690/why-we-cant-solve-...

> During Campbell’s last four months at Magic Leap, Abovitz—who always had been pouty and prone to temper-tantrums, began to dig his heels in even more in the face of dissenting ideas and to explode ever more frequently into child-like fits of rage, threatening retribution when he didn’t get his way, felt betrayed or was portrayed publically in an unfavorable light.

Ugh. It's just depressing how often you see people like this in positions of power.

Unfortunately, how do you think they got there? Stifling dissent.

Senior Engineer Eric Adams sent out an email December 4, 2015 through a company email list serv for social activities for Magic Leap employees and their families, which email bore the subject line, “Board (sic) Wives at home while you are loving it at the Leap,” which stated:

----

Hello Leapers:

My wife is starting a Google group outside of the Magic Leap locked domain.

It is called “Magic Leap spouses” and should be findable as such.

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/magic-leap-spouses

It is sort of a social meeting place for all the spouses that have been displaced, alone in the daytime and are new to the area, would like to have lunch with or just to have someone local to hang out with when their significant other is slaving away at work thru-out the 12-Hr day. Or are they just nagging you because you moved here?

Please forward this Email to your wife if she would like to get better acclimated to South Florida. The group is not public and is reasonably private (by email invite/accept) as to not accidentally disclose any Magic Leap secrets.

----

The gender-neutral reference to “spouses” notwithstanding, implicit in the subject line and the reference to “your wife” is the assumption — which is not too far from wrong — that all the employees were men with wives who didn’t work outside the home and were “alone in the daytime.”

----

This type of allegation is why we enjoy the particular character treatments portrayed in Silicon Valley.

Heck, even that AR mustache startup in season 2 looked more authentic then Magic Leap's secretive technology.

"Eric Akerman, vice president of IT, is a high school buddy of Abovitz. He is a loud and outspoken and several misogynistic comments have emanated from his department and from him."

"Vice president of IT Akerman, on Nov. 8, 2016, told a large group of people who asked why he voted for Trump that it was 'because Melania is hot.'"

Rony Abovitz gets away with corporate murder - most of the reputable senior executives have fled his his Plantation, Florida Jones town or being sued. He raised the money to waste on lawsuits, just look at the records and testimonies - there is no product, just Abovitz's bullshit. He is not capable of delivering a product. Google made a stupid investment, and with Sundar and Scott Hassan on their board they are still allowed to run a shit show with Google's approval. No other startup could pull one like this. Total Magic Shit.

The complaint itself is interesting. Lots of inside information on not just the discrimination issue, but other critical commentary about the company.

One example:

"admonitions ignored in favor of her malecolleagues’ assertions that the images and videos presented on Magic Leap’s website and on YouTube were “aspirational,” and not Magic Leap’s version of “alternate facts.”"

It didn't occur to me anyone would think those were anything but concepts.

Some videos said they were shot through magic leap technology, presumably they were. The rest are mock-ups and concepts.

I assumed she was referring to the ones with the overlay text of "Shot directly through Magic Leap technology..." Maybe you're right though.

The most infamous misleading video that currently claims to be a "concept video" was originally deceptively titled "Just another day in the office at Magic Leap" and described as "This is a game we’re playing around the office right now". Only AFTER they got busted, did Magic Leap retroactively change the title and description so they were not so blatantly false and misleading.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPMHcanq0xM

Before they got busted and white-washed the lies, a skeptical Time magazine reporter didn't think it looked real, and asked Magic Leap about it directly. The official Magic Leap company spokesman mendaciously lied to him that "the video was authentic":

http://time.com/3752343/magic-leap-video/

It's unclear whether the video shows an actual game overlaid onto a real-world office space or just an artistic rendering of what the game might look like in the future. The way the gun rests so realistically in the gamer's hand certainly raises suspicions. Still, a company spokesperson confirmed to Gizmodo that the video was authentic.

"This is a game we’re playing around the office right now," Magic Leap wrote on its official YouTube account.

I know it's settling a lawsuit, but isn't it nice that Magic Leap has actually done something for once?

More seriously, I'm continually annoyed by this "woman hired to combat sexism" thing. It's a special case of a scenario plenty of us will recognise: where a problem with your boss is somehow your problem to sort out.

You can see why they settled. Those documents are brutal and they would have lost so badly.

There is also the fact that if the trial went public, she could seriously damage the company with NON-discrimination claims. For example:

"Campbell also raised concerns that what Magic Leap showed the public in marketing material was not what the product actually could do—admonitions ignored in favor of her male colleagues’ assertions that the images and videos presented on Magic Leap’swebsite and on YouTube were “aspirational,” and not Magic Leap’s version of “alternate facts.""

That could kill investment. I'd wager her lawyers knew this and it's likely considered a "good" legal tactic to force a settlement.

You know, it's honestly not that hard to not discriminate like this. I mean, I tend to do it all day. So why can't they?

I think it requires having respect for your co-workers as human beings.

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