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Comment by zeroer | Hacker News Reader

Yea, I agree the problem is not auctioning seats high enough. But the proximate issue is that United didn't offer cash, but $800 in United Fun Bux that are worthless for most people. The vouchers they were offering were only valid at dates United decided. The vouchers expired after a year. And they are offered in coupons for which you can only use one coupon per flight, and the excess value is lost.

Practically all news outlets are reporting that "United offered $800 in compensation", but the reality is that it's closer to $0 in compensation. It's disingenuous to call it "compensation".

A better move on the airline's part would be to offer some amount of airline credit, and then half that in cold, hard cash, at least up to $2,700 credit / $1,350 cash, which is what they have to give you for an involuntary bump.

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In the European Union, airlines are forbidden from offering vouchers as compensation for overbooking. They must pay cash.

Simple solution that fixed a consumer-hostile approach adopted by a cartel of companies. Sadly, the EU rarely gets credit for the great number of consumer protections it has established; instead people like to rant about egregious regulations that either don't exist or have been grossly misrepresented.

Where "people" == right wing press

Yes, the voucher thing is nonsense. I've been on overbooked flights before where I could have easily taken the next flight instead. I never volunteer, because the vouchers are worthless to me. Offer me cash and I'll often be first in line.

The only time I've volunteered to be bumped was when BA offered $700 in cash (technically I got a prepaid VISA card) and a free hotel+meals. That may be due to the EU though (there are passenger rights regulations about compensation for delays caused by the airline)

Back in the days when I traveled a lot, I would ask for some sort of on-the-spot compensation - usually, put me in first/business class on the rebooked flight. Sometimes it worked, sometimes not.

You can ask them to pay you in cash as long as you don't accept the offer before hand. They're legally required to compensate you with cash if you ask.

Surely they would just say "thanks, but no" and keep looking for suckers who will take a voucher?

Where "suckers" are people that don't like what you like?

I like to travel so I would rather take the $1000 voucher than wait for a cash offer that someone like you would jump on before I could get a chance.

I've taken in over $5,000 of free air travel over the years and always used it to visit family and see places I wouldn't have otherwise. In the meantime people thinking like you got nothing because it was a "sucker's" deal.

I suggest you look into the study of economics and pricing to understand how people can get different levels of value from things. The you might understand why auction systems like that aren't magically lining your pockets with gold.

>$800 in United Fun Bux

Yeah, exactly. They damn well know there is a 90+% chance you aren't going to be able to redeem it. Literally.

http://www.seattletimes.com/life/travel/travel-wise-donrsquo...

>Redemption rates on vouchers hover somewhere between 5 percent and 8 percent

Vouchers like that are egregious.

Now that it's too late, United is now offering up to $10k if they can't get someone to volunteer for less.

Up to 10k in vouchers. I don't even know how someone with a non-travel job would use that many coupons in a year.

A lot more easily when you realize what a Y-class economy fare costs (Boston to Hawaii next week? $2700+)...

Vouchers are typically only valid for full fare unrestricted economy fares or better, not V-class discount fares (display details when you browse your next flight).

This is simply not true...I've gotten these vouchers and used them and sure as hell wasn't buying y-class tickets.

You could trivially spend it on a single international holiday if you felt like flying in business or first class...

Actually no, you can't, because they limit how much you can apply to a single flight. To use up $10k in vouchers, it's likely you'd need to make 20-100 flights, before they expired in a year.

Where is this information coming from?

I've received large (not $10k) vouchers from major airlines before, and the only restriction is the expiration date.

They are effectively the same as cash for that airline, and I have yet to see a VDB voucher that is significantly restricted.

Airlines do give away a lot of "good will" certificates during irrops (e.g. weather events) to upset customers, which function more like coupons than traditional vouchers.

I'm happy to be proven wrong, but checking with a few friends who between us fly all the major US carriers - VDB vouchers are effectively airline cash with an expiration date.

Like the other reply you got, I've received a multi-thousand (but not $10k) voucher from United before and the only restriction was use within a year. I also didn't have to use on a single flight, but could use the full value on one flight if I wished (which I did, flew paid business, but was upgraded to first to APAC).

Ugh, please don't make unfounded claims like that.

I don't understand why there even is a limit. What happens if nobody takes the 10k? Someone gets beaten up again? If they are certain someone will leave for 10k why have the limit at all?

For $10k, you could probably charter a private plane. So unless every single passenger on the plane is a doctor flying out for an emergency brain transplant, there'd be no rational reason to decline it. For $100k, you could probably buy a small plane.

If they leave the plane docked until somebody agrees, then you could end up in a situation where you get to your destination slower if you stubbornly refuse. Then, you could argue that it's in their best interest to (beat them up if they don't move).

My objection wasn't even over booking. My objection was eviction after the passenger already sat down. To me, that was the unredeemable act. I'm also ashamed that the police department apparently did not accept responsibility. We often talk about how it is a systemic problem when we accidentally run rm -rf in production and find out none of our backups work but we turn around and say "Oh surely the police department is full of good hard working people if it weren't for a couple of bad apples" and completely throw some people under the bus. No, the organization has life of its own and things won't change if heads don't roll at the top.

You can actually ask for cash. Most people don't realize it's an option but they will give you a cashier's check on the spot.

That's if you're getting involuntarily bumped. Far as I know, if you volunteer, you can only get vouchers.

There's nothing prohibiting you from asking for cash and there's no law that prohibits airline from giving it to you.

Calling airline vouchers 'worthless to most people' is pretty stupid. The vast majority of the population would love to travel more and is constrained mainly by their budget. The proof of this is how Delta never seems to have problems and they constantly offer Delta dollars.

And then you have guys like me, who fly very rarely and only if no other options are available. Any voucher tied to flying is inherently worthless, because not only I've lost a lot of time but also the whole point of flying - being able to move quickly from one place to another - is defeated by the fact that I'm now stuck in the airport.

To top that off, if this happened during a holiday it means I'm getting a bad deal anyway - if I'd want money I wouldn't take vacation days in the first place.

Then you wouldn't accept the bid. That's the entire point of an auction system.

Vast majority of the population wants to travel more but, of all things, the cost of a plane ticket is holding them back? No, this is not true.

I travel for pleasure about once a year. I can travel more if I wanted to, finances don't hold me back, but once a year is enough for me. Traveling for vacation is usually pretty fun but at the same time just stressful enough that I wouldn't want to do it more than once a year. Airplane travel is really inconvenient.

Plane tickets are just a small part of the cost of a vacation so a free ticket isn't magically going to make them afford extra travel. United isn't paying them for their hotel, rental car, and activities they are going to do when they go on this extra vacation.

Even if you do make use of the vouchers, you better hope that United flies to that place you want to go and you have enough time off saved up at work and your schedule works out to use that voucher before it expires. I know you get a year but people have schedules and usually only have windows where it works out to take vacation.

If you are a business traveler you better hope you actually like traveling for pleasure.

You are very disconnected from a huge chunk of the US population. Traveling with a family of 4 to visit extended family on a popular period like Christmas or Thanksgiving (i.e. when typical middle class people get time off) will cost upwards of $2000 for a round trip flight a thousand miles away or so.

Most of the US population doesn't get very much vacation time from their employer. The problem isn't the cost of airfare (which is a tiny portion of the cost of any vacation compared to hotel, meals, rental car, etc.), the problem is a lack of time.

That's wrong. Most people get 2 days off every week. If you have a good priced airline voucher that means you can make a weekend trip to NYC, have dinner, see a Broadway show, spend the night and then fly back.

Flying out a Friday night and returning Sunday is the most expensive component of a weekend trip like that.

Oh please. Traveling is tiring for most people, especially with TSA and the hectic mess that is airports, and the severe discomfort of modern airplace seating; I don't know many people who really want to fly somewhere on a Friday evening right after work (meaning you get to your hotel somewhere around midnight if you're lucky, and you have to skip dinner) and return on a Sunday (meaning you get home late, leaving you exhausted for work on Monday).

Oh please, cramped seats? Use the voucher for economy comfort or first class. Have dinner in the airport if it's that inconveniently timed.

We went on weekend trips when I was little that involved driving for 4 hours each way. Most people aren't as pathetic as you are portraying.

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