Wealth isn’t created at the top, it is merely devoured there
theguardian.com
theguardian.com
The other big subsidy program for lenders is borrowing money from the Fed at low rates which can then be lent at much higher commercial rates. That's the welfare state for banks.
It doesn't have to be that way. Japan and China inject money into the economy by building, and sometimes overbuilding, publicly funded infrastructure. The banking system plays a lesser role in economic stimulation. This has its advantages; usually the infrastructure is good for something.
Nothing is avoiding a tax.
http://money.cnn.com/2013/07/01/news/economy/corporate-tax-r...
Life insurance and disability payouts are typically tax-free because they're paid into with after-tax dollars, but the insureco will invest the funds as it sees fit.
I wouldn't point to these as a panacea for economic policy. China has ghost cities which they won't populate: the people for whom they were built can't afford to live there.
Japan is overworked, sleeping in the office and drinks with the boss are mandatory. Is that the society towards which we ought to advance?
Not excusing the short term interests of America's big banks, however, you need to be ready for other disadvantages if you change the way the game is played in America.
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-speed_rail_in_China
[1] http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-bullet-cost-ov...
every single one of them had to be rebuilt. Welds that should have run the length of plates were often just enough to get it to hold together, and not the full length. Pipe were substituted for solid metal bars. Low quality steel was used, stuff that would disintegrate when struck with a hammer by one of the engineers. The "cheap" contracts that the National Government sought ended up costing much more than what it would have cost them to build locally.
I wouldn't be very keen to ride on the high speed Chinese rail networks.
It's getting better. Jet brand machine tools used to have huge quality problems around 2002, and now they mostly work out of the box. It was clear at one time that Jet was shipping their rejects, but that seems to have stopped. They're still below Hardinge, but up there with Delta now.
The cities aren't empty because of economics. This is not a big secret. They were built as part of a social plan, along with a nice boost to the economy since they are their own raw material supplier (steel in the US almost exclusively comes from China). The Chinese "ghost cities" are a complete nonsequitor in regards financial planning.
It costs money to build those cities, and nobody is living there to add to GDP. That definitely impacts their finances.
Especially in technology, does anyone really believe that if these particular individuals hadn't contributed their talents, the world would have turned out much different?
Would there be no operating systems without Gates? No social networks without Zuckerberg? No search engines without Page? No e-commerce without Bezos? (Granted, Bezos is pretty exceptional.)
Why should particular individuals capture such massive rewards when their success had more to do with circumstance than anything else?
(There's a connection here to the "great man theory" of history and its critiques.)
It's also funny how we make heroes out of corporations themselves, not only their heads : technological advance is often attributed to some specific companies, and we don't see that as appropriation of the results of particular circumstances, but as a sign of the performance of this company.
However; Would there be no XXXXX if we didn't live in an environment that attributes the results of circumstances to specific individuals ? I really don't know.
How far down the rabbit hole would we be going to go with this? Who gets to decide what the capital cutoff point is for "too massive" and the contribution cutoff point is for "due to circumstance"?
If I don't believe in free will, and thereby claim you make too much money because you technically weren't responsible for any of your actions and never chose the outcome that happened, can I incite a communist revolution and seize your assets? If I feel someone won the lottery because they were lucky, do I get to take all their money because they didn't contribute value or "earn" it in a way that I find agreeable?
Can you give me an example of someone who is wealthy who earned their money in a manner that isn't arguably due to circumstance? As it stands, I can't think of an example that is materially different from a tech CEO who happened to be in the right place and right time. Go far enough back and every idea and execution on that idea is due to chance. But that applies to everyone, not just tech CEOs, or whoever the robber baron of the week is.
This whole concept is like saying, well, one guy decided to do the things he loved, go to baseball games, get drunk with his buddies, and watch copious amounts of TV. But this other guy spent 8 years educating himself and working his butt off accomplishing many things. Let's reward them equally because they both grew up in the same town thus should have equal outcomes.
I'd be fine having a discussion about what's "too massive" for a company and trying to figure out how to balance the interests of society and any given company (and its constituent individuals). But I'd like to start from a position of, what do we want society to look like? rather than a position of, how do we preserve the status quo?
Sorry, looks like you got outvoted.
Now you want to sit on some panel of judgement to overrule the public.
I love it when people say stuff like this. Society has spoken. You simply don't like their decision so your answer to is to create some super-powerful organization that can veto the public and instill its own version of what society should look like.
Fortunately, now, for the most part, in the west, we all get a say in that super-powerful organization.
It, and everything it spawns, like mega-corporations, exists to serve us, not the other way around.
If you want people to continue to take large risks, you need to offer them good rewards if they succeed, and/or reduced downside in the case of failure.
Is this what you think drives people like Jobs? The guy who had billions, worked relentlessly, and died of Cancer at a fairly young age?
How would you disprove this belief, short of an alternate-universe device?
To me, it feels a bit like saying: "There aren't that many apex predators, therefore Leo the Lion must have incredible intrinsic properties"... Ignoring the fact that the local ecosystem doesn't allow that many contenders in the first place, and overlooking how many baby lions Leo kills.
The ability to kill all your other competitors does imply something about your intrinsic properties. But I don't think that's very apt in this case, Musk and Bezos aren't intentionally killing lots of competitors in the cradle. The ecosystem comparison might be a bit more apt, and there are certainly a number of people who are very driven and long-term-focused who never achieve the same heights, because you can only have so many megacorps in each field. But I think those people that don't achieve the peak still end up much better off financially than pure luck and circumstance would imply.
I was mainly arguing against the sad-sack sour grapes tendency I've noticed recently to say that very rich people are just luckier, and are no more deserving of their status than anyone else. That is, frankly, bullshit, unless it's inherited.
That's not to say we shouldn't strive to give the educational and financial resources for everyone the opportunity to thrive, I certainly think we should do more there. Bolstering our state university system so that it once again offers everyone the chance for a very cheap high quality education would be a great start.
It's a constant (and often un-examined) uphill battle against stuff like the "hot hand" fallacy or fundamental-attribution-error.
That's why I feel the default assumption should be that they got there by chance rather than that there's some kind of narrative cause we find instinctually pleasing.
Who does something when matters. If the leaders of large tech companies were personally committed to free, open, and interoperable communications, we might have avoided the walled-gardens that we're currently stuck in. Similarly, if the NSA won the clipper chip debate back in the 90's, precedent for cryptography would likely be very different that what we have today.
There is actually no good theory of social value underlying capitalism. "More money = good, less money = bad" is crude and unsophisticated nonsense.
The reality is that there are many different activies creating "value": original invention in different flavours, packaging and industrialisation, marketisation, promotion, sponsorship, monopolisation, wealth capture and tribute collection, destructive resource extraction, sustainable resource extraction, and so on. Among others.
Only some of these generate real value. Others consume real value. But market theory is too clumsily unsophisticated to highlight the distinctions in a way that maximises productive creation while minimising unproductive capture.
With respect to Microsoft, Facebook and Amazon, you are more correct. For instance, MS-DOS was originally QDOS (Quick 'n' Dirty Operating System) and bought off of another Seattle company by Microsoft.
I don't doubt that Larry Page is a talented man, but he was in the good place in the good moment. Now Google is in a dominant position and there's no place for any competition, but if Google never existed, we would have some other company doing similar things as Google. Maybe they would have appeared one year later.
Many scientific discoveries seem simple after the fact, like the Einsten's E=mc2, yet somehow it took one of the greatest minds in history of mankind to come up with it.
Indeed, at the same time as Larry Page was thinking about PageRank, Li Yanhong created and patented RankDex (a very similar page ranking algorithm) over in New Jersey - and built Baidu out of it.
The naive version you argue against here is fairly common. Some people actually think that if Edison hadn't invented electric light, we'd still read by candle light!
In reality, someone else would have invented the same or similar things fairly soon afterwards if these "heroes" hadn't done it first.
Then again, advancing the state of science and/or technology planet wide is enormously valuable, even if just by 1 month.
There is no way to measure this, but my guess is that without Steve Wozniak, microcomputers would surely have happened, but maybe 1 year later. What's a jumpstart like that worth for humanity as a whole?
It has to be noted though, that the same is also true for people with a criminal mindset that look to game the system. It's generally a hard problem to create laws that encourage "good" heroes and discourage "bad" ones.
Do you know the names of CEO's of Nokia and RIM? Do you know the name of the CEO who introduced the iphone?
I guess that should answer your question.
I could give the same movie script to 10 different directors and fund the production of 10 different movies and I guarantee you that at least a few of those movies you won't even know if they used the same script. People interpret the same information differently and have different visions based on that information. One might make it a RomCom. Another might decide it's an action movie.
And if one of them makes one that people overwhelmingly prefer and it makes a billion dollars, would you suggest that they give the money back because there should only be so much success afforded to a single person when 10 different people all had the same script?
You seem to imply that there would obviously be an operating system without Gates so why should he become rich? Well, there were several different operating systems, some might even argue superior operating systems, but they failed as businesses.
Coming up with a new or revolutionary idea is hard. What's equally difficult is turning that into a successful business. Microsoft could have easily been a total flop had it hired the wrong people or made the wrong decisions. Google could have ended up as neat little experiment that never quite got off the ground had they not brought in the right people.
But that's not just tech, that's not just business, that's life.
"We’re invited to believe that a CEO can somehow ‘earn’ £10m per year, whereas a teacher ‘earns’ £25k per year. That’s only possible if you divorce the word ‘earn’ from any of its actual meaning. No one can actually work enough hours, or create enough value, to equate to £10m."
I think this is the essence of the recent debate about inequality. I think most people would not have a problem with those who are genuinely producing more getting more as well. Think back to school, did you ever complain about your grades if you knew some other kid had worked harder? Me neither. Of course there were times when it seemed arbitrary as well, seemingly having no relevance to quality.
It's a big problem creating a notion of fairness when you move on from school, where everyone is the same age, in the same class, doing the same homework. To create software, for instance, what do you typically find? There's people of various ages, some managing, some selling, some writing code, some doing testing. You need all of them to get the job done, and the job has some sort of value, however vaguely defined, that is greater than the sum of its parts. Nobody on the team could do all of the team's work as effectively as the team.
So then we have the problem of attribution. There's no real way to say what fraction of the value someone created. The only thing we really have is negotiating positions. If you're able to say "Give me half or I'm taking my ball" convincingly, your teammates will give you half. They'll be thinking about a few things mainly: whether you'll really leave if turned down, whether they think they can replace you, and what deal they can put forth to other potential teams if you turn out to be irreplaceable.
This will have some interesting effects. If you're already making a lot, you'll probably need a lot to want to participate. You have more savings in order to hold out for a better offer. CEO guy "genuinely" needs more pay because why wouldn't he just retire now? Janitor guy will take any offer, because he needs to be running to stand still. Actually a lot of people will be in that position, even though their labour is generally seen as useful, like teachers.
Which is all just a long way of saying that the negotiating process does not in itself take merit as an input.
I don't think this is the case. Why aren't you hiring the janitor to do the CEO's job? Are you sure there's no merit in the negotiating process? You even undermined your point right here:
> They'll be thinking about a few things mainly: whether you'll really leave if turned down, whether they think they can replace you, and what deal they can put forth to other potential teams if you turn out to be irreplaceable.
At least one of the reasons someone is difficult to replace is because they have rare talents, they're particularly good at what they do...they have merit.
There's a lot of noise surrounding measurements of skill. Witness the regular articles here about how to interview people.
The reason why CEOs make so much is related to this. Very few people appear to have the skill, but that is also why their wages are inflated in relation to what they ought to get. Because the penalty for hiring an incompetent seems so high, we want to make absolutely sure we get a "real" CEO. This means there are loads of people who could do the job, but due to a lack of credentials such as appropriate previous experience, those people cannot be hired. There's also the fact that you can point to the credentials if things do go wrong. "They hired him there, so it must be our business that's hard to fix." I think it's Tyler Cowen who calls this a star system. Similar dynamics occur in other high paid labour markets.
If you look at what a CEO does, you have to wonder why so many divisional managers are often passed over for an external candidate. After all they should know a fair bit about the company and have similar skills.
On a more software related note, look at job ads for programmers. Why do they specify one web framework when probably anyone who's used any of the major ones would probably be able to learn quite easily? This type of dynamic probably gets even stronger when we're talking about high powered exec jobs.
It's not even a real argument against a corporation, since corporate raiders and the like also say CEOs are overpaid.
At least CEOs have to get up and go to work every day - what does the word earnings have to do with heirs who get dividend checks every quarter from a company? They are as removed from the process of creating wealth as you can imagine.
Not personally, but I sure do remember jealousy from people who didn't -- want to -- work as hard or thought they didn't have "enough natural talent" to be like them.
I don't think it's too far off to say human mental models transcend class and that a portion of those who rally against inequality (because they are on the victimized end) are part of the group I described above.
As for how this applies to the discussion? I cannot think of anything. I just think it's important to remember human behaviour isn't fair, rational, or black-and-white (which on the surface flies against the "widespread mental model" claim).
It's a tiresome discussion. Why do we always bring up CEO compensations, but never Hollywood actors', professional athletes' or even painters' (or art traders' - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No._5,_1948)?
Salaries don't need outside validation by people why have no idea what the job involves, but try to assign some "value" to it anyway. It's a free market and CEOs don't get hired if they have outrageous demands and there are better candidates available.
I hear you, but there's usually a magnitude difference between these occupations and the highest paid CEOs.
Is there?
According to http://incomefile.com/richest/top-10-highest-paid-ceos-chief... , https://www.forbes.com/actors/#22dd8ef340fe and https://www.forbes.com/athletes/list/ it's the same range, approx. $20m-$100m.
I certainly bring up professional athlete salaries. Given that they produce absolutely nothing of value beyond a marketing opportunity, they're all overpaid for very little real work. It's not like they're curing cancer. Actors? Memorize some lines, and have lesser-paid minions tell you how they should be repeated.
All that's really happened is that a class of people have managed to market themselves to a section of the population - sports stars, actors, CEOs and politicians. They've made themselves superstars, and unfortunately, sufficient numbers of people believe in the legends that they can ask for whatever excess they like and get it.
So, if that's true, they are compensated for excelling at self-marketing, i.e. for having a valuable (in our society) skill and not for others' perception of "created value"? I personally have no problems with that and don't find it objectionable.
Likewise, a professional athlete plays on a sports team. That sports team generates millions of dollars a year in television contracts. Hundreds of people are employed both at the stadiums at which they play as well as at the television stations that air the games. Millions more are made from merchandising, jerseys, hats, etc from the sports team. Hundreds more are employed making and selling those products.
And yes, they also become marketing machines. Yet that marketing machine sells products and people are employed at those companies that make and sell those products.
The ripple-on effect of a super-star professional athlete like Michael Jordon or LeBron James generates wealth for tens of thousands of people.
Do you mean that whenever we discuss CEO remuneration we must also add a parenthetical remark to the effect that the discussion most likely also applies to a list of other categories of person?
If so then I think we can simply petition HN to add such a declaration to the terms and conditions of the web site, for instance:
- Any discussion of remuneration of any entity receiving more than 1MUSD per year is deemed to include all other categories of entity where at least one member of that category receives at least that amount.
If not then we must litter our discussions with pointless qualifications. Perhaps it doesn't matter, a lot of the comments, this one included, do not advance the discussion so their content doesn't matter.
Once a CEO, always a CEO. Even if you blow up a few companies, you can always run for President (Carly Fiorina and many others)
You are not alone: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41562-017-0082
IIRC the research shows humans are perfectly fine with inequality, what gets us angry is "unfairness", or inequality that is not "earned".
Facebook is a people market. Spotify is a music market. Airbnb a hotel market. Uber a taxi market Amazon and eBay... Well, literally markets, right? And so on.
Markets obviously do create wealth, as a lubricant for trade. It's a meta-level of the economy, just like money is a meta-good that makes bartering actual goods and services more efficient.
So saying that's it's all "rentier" without creating any wealth might be selling them short a bit.
Where I'm troubled is that they're not free markets, in any sense of the word. They are privately owned, and the owners try to control their markets for the sake of their own profit. That's where things get problematic, I'd say, especially when there is a monopoly.
The middle class is the class that feeds the unproductive classes at both the top and the bottom. And the unproductive have formed a political alliance where the bottom votes for the top in exchange for handouts, all paid for by the middle.
https://www.strongtowns.org/journal/2017/1/9/the-real-reason...
Alternatively, read the DoJ report on Feeguson.
The middle class gets taxed as much or more than the lower and they put in more due to simple economics.
You're ignoring the economic effects of money being immediately spent on consumer goods and services.
https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/food-nutrition-assistance/su...
> An increase of $1 billion in SNAP expenditures is estimated to increase economic activity (GDP) by $1.79 billion. In other words, every $5 in new SNAP benefits generates as much as $9 of economic activity.
1) SNAP is cyclical - so it's gonna naturally boost a struggling economy, as would most other expenditures
2) there's a natural limit - there's only so much food a family needs
There's also a point where a family may demand more food but providing them with it actually harms society. The obesity epidemic is the biggest health crisis this country has ever faced and when 40% of SNAP recipients are obese (compared to ~32% of nonrecipients), we're basically paying to sentence these people to a litany of expensive, chronic medical issues. Of course, merely reducing benefits does nothing to solve this and harms the 60% of recipients who are at a healthy weight, I'm just pointing out that the natural limit of demand is far beyond the optimal level of supply for a program meant to provide a net benefit to society.
Source: https://www.fns.usda.gov/sites/default/files/ops/NHANES-SNAP...
Just of the top of my head for frozen water that falls from the sky: snow, sleet, powder, crusty, ice, slush, hail, wet, thick, dusting, etc...
And for wealth : cash, money, asset, value, income, revenue, etc
old money
| Was the wealth created?
nouveau riche
| Or was it taken at the expense of others?
plutocrat/oligarch
No, it doesn't. Justifying the choice is good after it turns out good as some sort of moral strategy. The choice (of how to use absurd wealth) is now subject to not-society. So any benefit is accidental, at best. It can easily be lit on fire and that is just as bad because society gets no say in it.
From my reading of [1], the Polio Vaccine was developed by Jonas Salk at the University of Pittsburgh.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/chinese-philanthro...
I totally agree that the ambiguity you described is an issue. It's unfortunate that common political parlance isn't in a habit of defining its terms as a step 1a before proceeding in a discussion.
>Take a look at the Forbes 400 list of the wealthiest Americans. About half the people on the list are entrepreneurs whose companies did very well (thanks to hard work as well as a lot of luck). Contrary to Piketty’s rentier hypothesis, I don’t see anyone on the list whose ancestors bought a great parcel of land in 1780 and have been accumulating family wealth by collecting rents ever since. In America, that old money is long gone—through instability, inflation, taxes, philanthropy, and spending.
This is exactly why I don't buy the "rentier class" argument. Even the mega-wealthy families of the robber-baron era are not that well represented in these lists.
The other take on the wealth that is rarely discussed is the incentive that the ability to secure the lives of ones offspring provides - it is a very powerful drive. I suspect a large number of very talented individuals would accelerate their retirement if they were not able to pass their wealth on to their kids.
While I heavily rely on my skills/labor for income, even I would make very different choices if I had no hope of passing on at least something. Fair or not, it's a pretty primal instinct.
I in fact personally know a family that still owns land they somehow acquired in the 1700s. But they're not the billionaires or hundred millionaires that roam todays capitalistic system.
They're.. well off? I would call it FU money, but given they (sort of) have to pass it down the generations for forever, they definitely spend a lot less of it and enjoy it less.
May be because bulk of that wealth is locked in Trusts. And passed on through Trusts.
The Bezos, Zuckerberg's and Gates will leave behind Trusts which their descendants will inherit. You won't find their names in the richest person list in the next few decades. Their descendants will almost be as rich as the richest guy of their times. They will just be rich through a proxy.
I've actually had "you probably have a trust fund" thrown at me in college because I drove a sports car, but I worked 3 jobs to afford it and pay for education/rent/etc, so apologies if I'm overly skeptical about the trust fund claim.
This is bullshit, but it's very pernicious bullshit because while it only takes one person to pull this out of their ass, no one person can refute it. No one person can articulate where all the stuff in an iPhone came from; abstraction is one of the true marvels of technology today
Secret History of Silicon Valley
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTC_RxWN_xo
TL;DW The foundation for SV was laid during WWII by unrestrained spending (based on a huge amount of debt of course) by the US government on R&D. Private enterprise only came in once the foundation existed.
I remember Steve Mann from U Toronto demonstrating his augmented reality devices in the 1990s. They were very impressive for the time -- but they required him to wear a backpack of equipment and absurdly large goggles. We still aren't there yet, but Google Glass made his ideas into a semi-practical product.
Multi-billion what? Revenue? Yes, because they managed to monetize their traffic and keep it up despite fierce competition (attempts... by Google, for example). Market-cap? Yes because enough people who aren't typically extremely careless with their money invested in FB.
> All of their success comes from the luck of being first
First at what?
They didn't have to do anything, that's the point. They have such strong network effects. They would have to completely fuck up to lose even a tiny fraction of their userbase.
Apps. Messenger. Instagram.
They didn't get that network by just being first(ish). They got it by continuously being the best of the imperfect options, and they can lose it just as easily.
Look at Blackberry and Nokia. You don't necessarily have to fuck up, it can be you're simply not moving fast enough.
Flickr, Myspace, bebo, there are plenty of companies who were early and lost their advantage or went out of fashion.
Not as soon as I find a link or invite to Marxbook, the non multi-billion dollar Facebook competitor all my friends and everyone I meet every day is on! Unfortunately - I don't know how - but somehow I can't seem to find a link. Do you need an invite? I've tried the obvious search[1] but I simply can't find it.
Since this is an anonymous forum where I won't face any repercussions, I am going to admit to you that in my heart of hearts I am beginning to question whether Marxism really works at all. In moments of weakness, I think the answer to the question
>Does Facebook deserve to be a multi-billion dollar company?
is, "obviously yes!". It would help if I could at least sign up to Marxbook. I feel like I'm not being a good member of the Proletariat. How does North Korea do it? Maybe we could try shutting off the electricity every night. It might not make Marxbook happen, but it would at least reduce Facebook usage. Capitalist pigs.
How is that not going to be a billion dollar company? Like, what do you imagine here?
I am having a lot of trouble imagining how your description is not worth a billion dollars, if everyone is on it. Even under the model you described.
Back then we had public utilities. In the Sixties they envisioned the Cloud to be run like a public utility. The scary thing is that this model has become entirely unimaginable to a whole generation.
This has never happened in the past, but similar things have happened, always driven by violence. Can this happen without violence, I wonder?
If you can get enough people on your side to win a war, you can get enough people on your side to win an election.
Given the heat of pushback on small tax increases, I wouldn't bet on this happening without chaos. I wouldn't bet on it happening with chaos either.
There's a big difference between pushback on increasing taxes from zero to five percent, or ten to fifteen percent ... and pushback on increases from 40 -> 42% or 45 -> 48%.
In the US, it is the latter that we are most frequently discussing and it is the latter that gets all of the pushback that you find so familiar.
If you think your chlorine level is too high in your pool, shouldn't you oppose all increases, no matter how minute ?
If your blood pressure is too high, shouldn't you be opposed to all increases, regardless of how small or how much "you can afford it" ?
Some people (like me) think that effective tax rates of roughly 50% (US, California, Marin County) are too high. I would then, ipso facto, be opposed to further increases and I am troubled by the fact that this is considered a definite political marker. It's not.
For them to complain that their chlorine level is too high, when in the past it was twice as high or higher, and they were still living high on the hog? Sorry, don't care how they feel, tax the heck out of them.
Income taxes were never significantly higher than they are now in the United States.
You are thinking of the anti war profiteering tax brackets that were put into place after the entry into WW2. This was not a tax increase in the way you think of it and it was not designed to generate revenue or redistribute wealth - it was a patriotic act to ensure that nobody benefited financially from the prosecution of the war.
If you compare tax rates and use those as an anchor, you don't know what you're talking about.
Uh...you might want to check on that.
Wealthy people aren't getting taxed 50%. You're thinking of income taxes. Wealthy people don't make income. Genuinely wealthy people make their money from land they own and rent out and from stock they invest and hold.
The grocery store won't take stock certificates in payment for a gallon of milk. Instead, you have to sell it. As soon as you do, you are recognizing a capital gain and are taxed on it.
Which is why the most common advice among long-term real estate owners is "buy more property".
Wealthy people don't have a higher need for milk (or any basic necessities) than the average person. So why would they need to sell any significant portion of their wealth? As someone said elsewhere in this thread, the problem is we don't tax wealth directly, only when it's transferred.
Income tax is indeed what I am talking about and people do indeed get taxed at (roughly) 50%. You can use whatever term you'd like for those people.
The income limits for the top tax brackets are in the low six figures. Presumably you'd see those raised significantly to avoid these punitive rates on the "non wealthy" ?
Good lord, is this really true? I don't know about you people, but the basic pre-reqs for my undergrad had a single overview economics class where we covered among many other things the definitions of capitalism and profit and the idea that profit equals the difference between the sale price of a commodity and the cost of goods & labor used to produce it -- literally the definition of profit disagrees with the idea that wealth is created at the top, whatever that is even supposed to mean.
> When you think about it, it’s insane. We are forking over billions in taxes to help our brightest minds on and up the corporate ladder so they can learn how to score ever more outrageous handouts.
There's a lot about the world that gets completely insane if you think too much about it. Cars are insane. Jobs are insane. Politics and money are insane.
We have to have better options for smart people than highly compensated and interesting work at Facebook and Google. How do we create better options? I don't think pointing it out will cause better options to materialize.
> Yet it doesn’t have to be this way. Tollgates can be torn down, financial products can be banned, tax havens dismantled, lobbies tamed, and patents rejected. Higher taxes on the ultra-rich can make rentierism less attractive, precisely because society’s biggest freeloaders are at the very top of the pyramid. And we can more fairly distribute our earnings on land, oil, and innovation through a system of, say, employee shares, or a universal basic income.
> But such a revolution will require a wholly different narrative about the origins of our wealth. It will require ditching the old-fashioned faith in “solidarity” with a miserable underclass that deserves to be borne aloft on the market-level salaried shoulders of society’s strongest. All we need to do is to give real hard-working people what they deserve.
OH! That's all we need to do, eh? It's so easy! :)
It's not the first time this has been suggested. There are even names for this. And it sounds great. But the forces keeping our system the way it is are stronger than this. The narratives we need about the origins of wealth already exist, and they're not strong enough to turn the tide. I don't know what is strong enough to turn the tide.
"In reality, it is precisely the other way around. In reality, it is the waste collectors, the nurses, and the cleaners whose shoulders are supporting the apex of the pyramid. They are the true mechanism of social solidarity."
Jobs such as waste collection will be completely automated away in the next decade. I suppose machines then will be the true mechanism of "social solidarity"?
"But there is also a second way to make money. That’s the rentier way: by leveraging control over something that already exists, such as land, knowledge, or money, to increase your wealth. You produce nothing, yet profit nonetheless. By definition, the rentier makes his living at others’ expense, using his power to claim economic benefit."
It seems like the author believes that any gain to one group can only happen at the expense of another. Yet we know this to be false - the pie can and does get bigger.
"revealed that much of the financial sector has become downright parasitic. How instead of creating wealth, they gobble it up whole."
Agree, but curious to understand which industry the author doesn't define as parasitic? All companies want to expand and grow relentlessly, that's just the nature of capitalism. Cable/Telecom? Oil and gas? High Tech? All of them have become "parasitic" if that's how the author wants to define it.
"Higher taxes on the ultra-rich can make rentierism less attractive, precisely because society’s biggest freeloaders are at the very top of the pyramid. And we can more fairly distribute our earnings on land, oil, and innovation through a system of, say, employee shares, or a universal basic income."
Wrong. Higher taxes, though welcome, will not be the solution. Nor will universal basic income. How does one not understand that with the rise of automation, the rich are about to get so much richer, no matter how much you plan on taxing them. And basic income, though beneficial, won't fix class inequality either, in fact it might just exacerbate it.
Let's talk about something the author fails to even mention: Education. Class inequality is fixed by education equality. Period. End of story. The rich in the USA have access to far better education, and THAT is the true source of the rising inequality.
To call earning passive income on assets one owns "rentier" earning of income is to show unquestioned acceptance of socialist assumptions about the right to property, to ignore the value the person's assets contribute, and to totally neglect the role that delayed consumption (aka saving) and investment analysis, both components of investing and acquiring assets, have in wealth generation.
This is the quack economics the article is promoting:
>To understand why, we need to recognise that there are two ways of making money. The first is what most of us do: work. That means tapping into our knowledge and know-how (our “human capital” in economic terms) to create something new, whether that’s a takeout app, a wedding cake, a stylish updo, or a perfectly poured pint. To work is to create. Ergo, to work is to create new wealth.
>But there is also a second way to make money. That’s the rentier way: by leveraging control over something that already exists, such as land, knowledge, or money, to increase your wealth. You produce nothing, yet profit nonetheless. By definition, the rentier makes his living at others’ expense, using his power to claim economic benefit.
"Family ownership" and transferring wealth to heirs tax free.
> He uses a single over-arching idea (rent)
literal eyeroll Yay for semantic arguments.