Hacker News Reader

Comment by rochellle | Hacker News Reader

Kim Jong Un doesn't quite strike me as a suicidal personality. Furthermore, I suspect he is not surrounded suicidal staff.

There's no end-game in a spontaneous lashing out at anybody in the region. It's not a winnable situation for North Korea to attack anybody. They don't get anything from actual violent belligerence.

They're basically a bee hive. They've got their territory, and there's not much else happening, except maybe them screwing around on the internet for kicks, and their science projects like their ICBM program.

At some point, his wife will bear a son. He'll have an heir, and life goes on.

But what if war cracked the country open, and he got taken out. What would a re-integration of North Korean society look like?

View on HN

I don't think what we need right now is a world police, especially not an American one. But, since you mention a region on earth that you seem to think is in need of integrating with the rest, what would you think would happen to the region that is USA if civil war cracked it open? Do you think at least half of that country could be integrated with the rest of the world?

Gee, you seem to be pointing a tough question at somebody who advocated some "world policing" but I wonder who that was because it wasn't the parent post.

In fact, re-read that comment, because what was said pretty much advocated policing absolutely nobody.

But, okay, let's all argue. You're right. North Korea isn't isolated from the world at all, and its citizens pretty much go anywhere they want, do whatever they want, and come back home whenever they're done doing as they please.

But I wonder: if the typical North Korean citizen were unhappy (and we know they aren't), where would they go, and what would they do, if this hypothetical repressive lid (which doesn't exist) were suddenly lifted, and the pressure of a (normal) subculture were relaxed?

> But, since you mention a region on earth that you seem to think is in need of integrating

You do know that Korea was artificially split in half due to the ongoing war, don't you?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Division_of_Korea

Germany was also split, and was reunited. I don't believe it's necessary to explain why.

When the US does split you're going to have multiple fragments, one of which will be so impossible to deal with that everyone else will just pretend they don't exist.

> . They've got their territory, and there's not much else happening, except maybe them screwing around on the internet for kicks, and their science projects like their ICBM program.

Totally agree. In fact having a sense of security can help him and his people have a better life and help American taxpayers avoid another needless war.

I am not saying USA is at fault here but I think actually trying to increase trade with NK and letter NK be involved in world affairs littler more might help Kim actually do something better for his people. If USA polish bottoms of Saudi Arabia it can probably be little more nice to North Korea too. It might actually help the world peace.

I think China will use NK as a borrowed knife eventually or USA might attack its own soil and blame it on NK to start a war.

NK is a threat to its Soth Korean and Japanese neighbours, both US allies. So the US will never increase trade with NK to appease its sociopathic dictator. Rather than that they are moving a strike group with Aegis anti-ICBM missle capability into the area and talking to China saying "if you don't handle Kim, we will".

I doubt there is going to be any attack on NK. The strike group maneuver is merely ment to discourage Kim and show South Korea and Japan that the US is still a reliable ally.

Depending on who you ask, half of South Koreans would say US is being an unreliable ally, casually talking about actions that could start a war in Korea. If bombs start falling on Seoul, it would matter little to my family and friends who fired the first shot.

The common sentiment is "Shit, our allies and enemies are led by idiots. (Not to mention our own country, for the time being.) Let's hope nobody's crazy enough to do something stupid..."

They're all just showing off. I understand your concern, but South Korea is technically still at war with the North even if everybody only fires warning shots and plays propaganda over the border to annoy their neighbours.

South Korea itself had trade deals with its Northern neighbor until recently: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaesong_Industrial_Region

Yup, until NK started testing nukes and making threats.

Well my argument is that all US allies too should increase trade with Kim.

> So the US will never increase trade with NK to appease its sociopathic dictator

Well USA has very good trade relationship with China and Saudi both countries that would come second and third in terms of human rights abuses. In fact Saudi is a close ally.

It appears to me that USA wants a war and not to de-escalate the tensions and bring peace. All this eventually will come a a huge cost for South Koreans and US taxpayers.

When was the last time sanctions really worked ? India and Pakistan have very good nuclear arsenals and continue to build advance weapons despite all the threats and sanctions. Russia did not return the Crimea because of sanctions. Iran did not abandon its nuclear program because of sanctions.

The US is being pragmatic. China and the Saudis are countries you can do business with, not some wannabe bully threatening their US-allied neighbours and the USA with nukes. The last thing the USA wants in the Korean peninsula is war. They want to continue to do business as usual with South Korea, Japan and China without some pesky fatso dictator threatening regional stability with duct tape built nukes and ICBMs. But if it takes a few preemptive strikes to neuter Kim, they will gladly lend a hand.

It would look like enslavement via factory work.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com