Ask HN: How to overcome the feeling of being cheated by startup founders? | Hacker News Reader

Ask HN: How to overcome the feeling of being cheated by startup founders?

10 pointsthrowlongaway16 comments

Hello HN,

I'd like to receive advise on my below state:

Few years back, I joined a small (unknown) startup. The founders has no-prior startup experiences. Just a week after I joined them, they released DOA(dead-on-arrival) version. Their product has no quality and they can't find talent because no one willing to join their team.

I took it as challenge and fixed their product with-in next 3 years. Honestly, I did a 4 person job myself for a low-end salary. When the startup acquired by billar-dollar company, I was kicked out because I refused to shoe-lick the new boss. Founder didn't even gave me a chance to explain my position, told me to 'we will start your resign process today'. I was shocked and devastated by his attitude. Everyone in the team knows my dedication towards job. I never expected this. Most of my friends said, "you got cheated by that startup". few co-workers sympathetic towards me and gave some job-referrals.

I realized they don't need me anymore, because he sold his startup for millions of dollars. Other co-workers received 50k to 100k stock options after acquisition, I was left with 5k.

Later, founder became serial entrepreneur and started another companies. Whenever I come across his new startup or interview stories, I'll be hugely pissed off and angry. Even though it happened years back, I'm unable to let-go the feeling for being cheated. Financially, still struggling and unable to provide better health care to family - things like this makes even hard to forget this incident. I swear to god (if there was one), without my effort - they won't have been acquired. (I can provide more details, it may reveal startup/founder info).

Sometimes, when I see him on HN, I'll downvote his comment. Sadly thats the only thing I can do, vent out my anger :(

Any advise how to overcome this mindset? thank you.

You've got stuck in a way of thinking.

That's causing you some distress.

You've tried to move on, and your current techniques haven't worked.

You could try something like a short course of cognitive behaviour therapy. This will give you a structured technique to change your thinking.

You can self apply this from a book (although all the books tend to be focussed on the mental health aspect of CBT). One book that's often recommended is "Mind over mood", but there are others.

CBT is a short course of therapy - between 8 to 12 weeks, of one hour per week.

If you didn't want to try CBT you could try mindfulness or other meditation techniques.

thanks for the techniques, I'll read 'Mind over mood' and/or try meditation techniques.

For this type of thing I try to 're-frame' it in my mind as a lesson learnt, and that also (despite everything I'd hope in the world) there are some crappy people out there and I feel kinda sorry for them.

Turn your anger into sympathy for him, imagine what type of person he is and the daily life interactions he has had and will have with people that make him act this way.

Don't let his life actions affect your life anymore, remove the power he has over you.

(I feel I got a bit hand wavey there, sorry, but I find it really does help me, at least).

Thanks for suggesting different view. But I believe sympathy/empathy wont help me at this stage. Especially, considering the fact, I joined this startup without proper pay (thinking it will affect startup revenue) or relocation packages etc. The problem is , I can't remove this startup from my resume. When I join other places, obviously people want to talk about it and/or when I see ex-coworkers on places like github..it reminds those time again.

He don't have any control over me, he is thousands of miles away. My mind loses focus from time to time.

Can you expand on "shoe-lick" the new boss? That seems to be the crux of the situation.

(unable to login to previous account - created this one) Boss and founder are long time friends. Previously Boss worked in MNC's and he has no startup experience. He is non-technical. Now he created his own small group of fav. employees (just like MNC culture) and things looking not good.(co-worker said, 'i referred my friends to this startup, because it was a good place, but now I won't do that.') I don't agree with Boss views like 'quantity is important than quality'.

In our last meeting (after acquisition) he said 'you must agree with all our decisions & can't speak against it. Everyone is getting offer/benefits with new company, If you agree to this, you get that too.' I replied 'sorry, I can't blindly agree with whatever you decide, I'll share my views and let the team decide (or vote) which is right way'. (As years passed, I look back at this meeting and think if I decided to sacrifice my self-respect at this moment, I'm sure..I'd have stayed there and got benefits etc..but anyway thats the price i paid for being myself) I worked in MNC, I know he is trying to enforce similar environment on this startup. Startup founder was my last hope but he started the discussion with 'processing my resignation.'

Maybe you should reach out to him and ask him if he'd like to catch coffee or dinner. Have a civil conversation and try to lay out your case plain and simple. You'll never get over your problem if you can't face your fears.

Once you confront the object of your misery, you will be able to overcome it. And then on the way back to the car you can kill him in the parking lot

I'm not convinced, i can have a conversion. When i get betrayed by people whom i trusted, I never want their face again.

I sort of sense that you already know how to deal with this so I offer the following advice also for others seeking answers to similar questions.

This is not legal advice and shouldn't be construed as such. You're responsible for what you choose. Remember, revenge is a dish best served cold. You can always reheat it later to savor in your memory, but you don't want your emotions to get in the way of executing your legal revenge masterplan.

I'm going to mostly differ with the cautious, fix-yourself-first, it's-your-problem-of-perspective, advice others are offering. You haven't "let go" of this even after so many years. There is something real there. You're feelings are signaling something to you. If these people treated you unjustly, and you know that, don't cowardly hide from what your own feelings are telling you and hope you can meditate your way out of this. Live. Fight back. Stand up for yourself, and for what's right, and for justice. Instead of putting the blame on yourself to fix your perspective, take action that's legal to get redress for yourself and seek punishment for the ones who hurt you. This sense of grievance has already come to define you. Why dishonestly try to give that up? Lean into that, make a plan, and never ever give up until you win. It might take a while but at least you'll be moving forward. If it is so important, don't "move on" or "let go". Act. To make it better. It's the classic Hamlet question. Moving on or letting go when it really matters to you and when you could act, that's the kind of cowardly weak behavior that perpetrators want you to do so they can get away with hurting you. Your emotions are telling you you are not such a person. You have held onto this for years. That's strong, not weak. Giving up doesn't get justice for anybody. Giving up your fight just supports people hurting others with impunity. So with that said, what steps can you take?

First, try to learn how you can make yourself stronger and smarter so this doesn't happen again in future. Then start your plan.

0. Understand your own goals and feelings. What is the thing you are most angry about? Where do you feel you have no control? Where do you want control? Where do you feel powerless? What do you want to make happen?

1. Sue. Approach some different lawyers. Be patient and explain things very simply and succinctly to them. Don't tell your "sob story", just relate the facts because they're busy and are interested in evidence to make a case that can win, not in the emotion at this stage. A person who treated you like this probably made other mistakes ( in contracts and business ) that can you can exploit legally to win compensation for any injustice done to you. If you can win money from the person, you'll feel better.

2. Thrive. Otherwise known as revenge thrive. Make your own startup. Sell it for more money. Once you're successful, if you still feel aggrieved, you can use some of your money to make this person's life more miserable. Be creative. Start a bad PR campaign. Poach their employees. Fund legal actions against them.

3. Tell the truth about what happened. Name and shame. Make sure your story is known to everybody. Set the record straight to everyone. If this person expects to treat others wrong and be protected by their silence prove them wrong. Maybe you'll encourage others to come forward. Maybe you'll help prevent others experiencing unjust treatment. The more well known they are, the harder it is for them to claim libel or defamation against you.

4. Adopt some stoic philosophy. Read Marcus Aurelius' Meditations. Today. This will help you sort out which grievances can be naturalized by perspective gymnastics, and which require attention and action.ppp Some quotes for you: "When another blames you or hates you, or people voice similar criticisms, go to their souls, penetrate inside and see what sort of people they are. You will realize that there is no need to be racked with anxiety that they should hold any particular opinion about you.", "Reject your sense of injury and the injury itself disappears.", "If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself, but to your estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment.", "If someone is able to show me that what I think or do is not right, I will happily change, for I seek the truth, by which no one was ever truly harmed. It is the person who continues in his self-deception and ignorance who is harmed."

5. If you have taken all legal steps of redress, and thrived, and still feel aggrieved, get someone to help you reflect on what is really making you feel angry. It could be a friend, or a professional coach, mentor or therapist. Anger comes from fear. You could start by asking yourself: What am I afraid of?

6. Bonus. If you feel you are protected from negative karma, you can curse them, using whatever powers you believe in.

Thanks for the detailed advise. I felt really refreshing and thought provoking. I downloaded Marcus Aurelius pdf, will start reading. I need to follow 0,4,2,6,3 steps at this moment. Hopefully after above steps, 5 will be taken care. I prefer step 3 instead of 1.

Thanks a ton for taking time and writing detailed steps and advises.

You're very welcome. May all be well with you.

Publicly humiliate him. Post the details of the founder's current businesses and past businesses. Take out a few bench or billboard advertisements to warn people against this man and his future business. The way in which he behaved and treated you was despicable.

No way things can even up unless the wider world knows about this scheming con artist.

This is a great way to encourage a libel lawsuit. Even if everything you say is absolutely true, you'll still need to have lots of money to defend yourself in court. Someone who has millions of dollars can afford more lawyer hours than you can, so you may end up broke.

My advice: just move on with your life. Constantly dwelling on the past is holding you back. You've learned the lesson that some people are assholes, which can be valuable to you in the future if helps you avoid a similar situation.

thanks. I tried avoid news about him or his startup. But from time-to-time (once in few months), I go through this feeling. I learned one valuable lesson: Startups may be fun-loving, exciting, non-political environment upto certain point (mostly just before acquisition) but not always.

This is awful advice. Never, ever, do this.

thanks for understanding. I can understand the view, but I'm no-body, he is a well-known (millionaire) founder. It may help the world to know about him but I suspect it mayn't help me to overcome my state of anger/frustration/feeling of cheated. If I do so now, it may continue to haunt me for few more years.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com