Sleep Is the New Status Symbol

Keynes was right on the fundamental analysis, but wrong on how much people appreciate the luxuries that the extra money from working three days more than you need to can buy (plus, something about the satisfaction that many people derive from working). Most people lower middle class and up could easily get by on 2/5 of their current salaries if they made the necessary adjustments to their lifestyles -- including moving to a low-cost probably non-urban area. But that's simply not an attractive proposition to most people.

Now, of course, there's a chicken-and-egg thing going on where two-day-jobs largely aren't on offer, but I'd argue that's largely because there just aren't that many takers. Especially in IT, especially if you're above-average successful, it's conceivable that you could find and negotiate a two day a week remote position -- but even among the population that probably could do that, it just doesn't seem a lot are, or are even trying.

"work 2 days a week"

Startlingly accurate but rather than everyone living that way, we have a small and shrinking fraction of the population working full time or more, and longer "education" and earlier retirement/ageism than ever. As an economy that's about what we do, we're just not egalitarian about it.

Some people honestly just need 4-5 hours of sleep. I used to work for Zillow and their CEO Spencer only sleeps 4-5 hours a night. It's all he needs and all he's ever done, according to people who have worked for him for a long time.

But these people are the exception not the rule. I think the reason they tend to be successful is because they are up before everyone else and have time to get a lot accomplished before they are thrown into the day with everyone else's schedules pulling on them.

> Donald Trump claims to sleep 4-5 hours per night.

This might go some way to explaining why he comes across so batshit insane and authoritarian. Lack of sleep correlates with reduced empathy, increased aggression and loss of impulse control.

Margaret Thatcher too come to think of it. She claimed to only sleep four hours a night because any more was 'a waste of precious time'.

Melatonin. It's considered safe, normally produced by your body and there's very little tolerance (i.e., diminishing returns over time):

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12546989

If I was on a night out usually I wake up quite early, like around nine. Then I feel the hangover of course but I don't go to bed again, instead have my coffee and start working. That day I feel tired and less energetic but I know of course that this is from the nice night out. When I arrive home at night I'm longing for bed but don't go to bed anytime sooner or later than I'm used to go, which is around half past 11. Then I sleep in within a short amount of time after having read a few pages in a novel. That's my hangover day novelty.

> That sleep impairs learning is something I notice as well

Lack of sleep, presumably?

Have a kid. No more staying out until 4am and getting up at noon for you!

Both are status symbols - how little sleep you are getting but still managing to perform is an often macho status symbol at a certain middle class level. You are living the life and doing big work on very little sleep because you are just that tough and smart. wooooo.

however it is only a middle class status symbol. And in quite a lot of middle class jobs it seems required that you do this to stay in the middle class, because if you do take the time to sleep how will you keep up with the Jones'

On the other hand if you're poor there is no status symbol associated with getting little sleep, it is just something you often have to do.

And if you're rich there isn't any need for you to brag about how you stayed up late on the Andersen case for 4 nights this week, and got that out the door yeah.

When you're rich you can afford to sleep as much as you want, and that is the real status symbol.

The "lazy" things are more for those that sleep or laze around a lot during the day, or regularly sleep in for hours. There's no shame in the regular ~8 hours of sleep a day, besides maybe some nocturnal folk that claim to not sleep as much and instead DO ALL THE THINGS at night. They've got their own issues.

I used to hear this kind of humblebrag all the time in consulting: “I was up working until 4am and only got 2 hours of sleep.” Or, “I didn’t go home last night.” Or college: “I pulled an all-nighter finishing that project.” Extend that to pride in working 80+ hours/week for a startup or eating lunch/dinner at your desk.

It’s associated with being “a hard worker” or “a go-getter”. I associate it with poor productivity or time management, bad planning or scope management, unrealistic leadership expectations, and/or weak-willed individuals (e.g., unwilling to push back).

I travel regularly to tribal places! Some of them dont have electricity and they sleep at around 8pm and wake up early at 5 am. But the people who go to cities and come back sleep really late! The shift has been very dramatic and the more technology is adopted there seems to be an increase in discontent in an otherwise peaceful life.

On a side note: Earlier the tribals used to negotiate when there was a fight or crime,But once the police station opened the people seem to netgotiate less and use a third party to resolve the issue

As a side note, here's f.lux's response to night shift: https://forum.justgetflux.com/topic/3655/f-lux-vs-night-shif...

With the Creators update, Windows now includes a blue light filter too.

Yep. And we all have different levels of sensitivity to blue light. I'm super sensitive, so if I'm doing anything on screens at night it pretty much completely shuts down my melatonin production. If I'm coding, working, reading, or watching something on a device I literally won't become sleepy. And when I do go to bed I'll lay there for a long time before I can fall asleep.

Bottom line is that in order to go to sleep and get 8 hours, I have to be avoid device usage at night.

Everyone needs to sleep, drink and eat, it's just that these guys didn't need to do anything else. The status symbol in that case is to have no obligations and a lot of spare time.