Cold Does Not Increase Odds of Catching Cold (2016) | Hacker News Reader

Cold Does Not Increase Odds of Catching Cold (2016)

nytimes.com

163 pointsgeorgecmu53 comments

The studies mentioned are great, and they don't come close to approximating real life. Here are two mechanisms I could think of that weren't addressed by the article:

I just spent 5 minutes in the cold and my nose started running. People with a runny nose are likely to wipe it with their hands and then touch a doorknob or something, facilitating the spread of disease. Runny noses are far less likely in warm weather. And secondly, by the article's own admission rhinovirus replicates faster in cold conditions, while our own cells (and presumably immune system) are suppressed in cold conditions.

Counterpoint: http://www.nature.com/news/cold-viruses-thrive-in-frosty-con...

[...]low temperatures dampen natural defences against rhinoviruses, the leading causes of seasonal colds, in mice and in human airway cells[...]

Thanks for that article. It also links to this study from 2005 showing a correlation between accute cooling of the feet and the onset of cold symptoms in humans. The studies on cell apoptosis were attempting to show why (according to the nature article). Interesting that the original article doesn't mention this 2005 study.

https://academic.oup.com/fampra/article-lookup/doi/10.1093/f... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16286463?dopt=Abstract&h...

> Interesting that the original article doesn't mention this 2005 study.

But it does and even links to it. (As does the article in folli's link.)

Other evidence:

What they discovered was that when a virus invaded warmer cells, the host cells produced significantly more interferons -- proteins that "interfere" with the spread of a virus by warning healthy cells of its presence and setting off an immune response.

In the cooler nasal cavity cells, this warning system was less efficient however, and allowed the virus to spread more easily.

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/there-scientific-re...

Is the correct conclusion?

Cold weather does not cause a cold, but increases the statistical probability of contracting one.

Another counterpoint (from a centre investigating the common cold): http://www.cardiff.ac.uk/common-cold-centre/the-common-cold

Can a chill cause a cold?

A study at the Common Cold Centre in 2005 took 90 students and chilled their feet in cold water for 20 minutes and showed that the chilled group had twice as many colds over the next 5 days as a control group of 90 students whose feet were not chilled.

Pretty much impossible to blind that study, though: the subject definitely knows whether or not his feet have been in cold water for 20 minutes.

You could sedate them, I suppose. Although I wouldn't be surprised if that would overcast entirely the suppressing effect of the water.

Did they purposefully expose people to cold viruses during that time? If not, it's a preposterously large effect size.

Without the actual numbers, it might be that one person from the unchilled group got sick and two people from the chilled group.

That study was mentioned and linked to in this thread's article. Quote:

>It may also be, as a 2005 study in The Journal of Family Practice showed, that people who are exposed to cold are more likely to report symptoms, even if they aren’t actually infected more often. Perception, and even potentially a belief in this explanation, may contribute to its longevity.

I am probably wrong, but my understand has been that being cooler longer-term, say living at 50 degrees reduces peripheral circulation. This provides a place for the virus to replicate with less immune interference.

It seems like many of the studies to disprove cold temps -> rhino are just acutely exposing people to more extreme cold temps. I also wonder, what we colloquially refer to as colds is a superset of rhinoviruses, any study should prob. test all the common cold viruses?

Also, a probably controversial tangential anecdote, my wife and I started taking 3 Vitamin D (2000 IU Summer, 3000 IU Fall/Spring, 4000 IU Winter) a year ago and neither one of us has gotten the cold or flu since knock on wood. This is not only surprising considering numbers of sick co-workers, but also an anomaly historically for us. I know Vitamin D has an effect on the passive immune system that lowers TB and influenza infection rates, I wonder if this same is true for rhinoviruses....

the problem with 'studies' is that they try to treat the world as binary, when its all systems.

the vitimin d thing is interesting, cold = dont go out = dont get vitimin d. try sleeping in a cold room with no clothes/blanket. will wreck your immune system fast.

Honest question, do people really find sleeping in cold rooms with little/no clothing to cause illness? I'm probably an outlier (last illness was food poisoning in 2003), but I sleep through the winter in boxers, covered in a light sheet, with the heat set low (65F, higher if I had a GF at the time and she was sleeping over).

Is it the shock to the body for those unaccustomed to it, or just another area where I'm at outlier?

i think 65 with a sheet is within the optimal sleeping range :) i should have quantified, <60 = cold

A lot of people don't realize too warm is bad too, less restful sleep, elevated cortisol etc

Current UK advice for infants is to keep the room at 18 C.

http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/pregnancy-and-baby/pages/reduci...

The "Keep Warm, Keep Well" (mostly aimed at older people) suggests a minimum temperature of 18C, but also says that you can have it cooler if you're comfortable and healthy.

http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/winterhealth/Pages/KeepWarmKeepWe...

65F is 18C.

Cold weather increases odds of catching a cold because it makes us more likely to stay indoors with other people, some of which may be sick and contagious.

Also, burning wood in a fireplace is very bad for your lungs and respiratory system and can make you more susceptible to infections.

Get outside and you probably won't catch anything. Norwegians let their babies nap in sub-zero temperatures and they're fine!

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-21537988

FWIW, we generally bring the babies inside for naptimes once it drops below -10C (14F). Otherwise they nap outside all year, true.

> Cold weather increases odds of catching a cold because it makes us more likely to stay indoors with other people, some of which may be sick and contagious.

I'm not convinced that's the case these days. The average city-dweller stays indoors with other people for most of the day, year round.

My understanding is that its not technically the person being cold that increases the odds, but the fact that the air is generally drier when its cold outside. This allows viruses to travel further, and also causes the nasal passages to be drier, letting bacteria enter more easily.

I catch most colds when the weather is humid, so the cold air can creep underneath my clothes.

Meanwhile, history buffs might appreciate that we're still using a 16th century[0] term to describe a disease that is being studied 60+ years after etiological discovery[1] for which available remedies are modestly effective and not without risks [2][3].

[0] http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=cold [1] http://blog.wellcomelibrary.org/2013/09/fighting-the-cold-wa... [2] http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/article-abstract/185731... [3] http://retractionwatch.com/2016/12/29/jama-article-zinc-comm...

A few years back I saw a study that reported that cold viruses survived longer outside the human body in cool temperatures than in warm (not below freezing, but the equivalent of refrigerating them.)

That makes sense, and since you won't get a cold unless you pick up a viable cold virus, this would imply that the chance of getting a cold would be higher in cooler weather, because there are more cold viruses on the surfaces around you that haven't yet been denatured by heat.

I don't know if this hypothesis has been explicitly tested, but it seems to me as though it could explain why people get more colds in winter than in summer but are not usually made sick by playing in the snow or taking a plunge in frigid water. The cold doesn't do anything to the people, it just preserves external viruses longer making the environment "dirtier".

Although, ICU and emergency wards at most if not all hospitals are kept cooler than other places in part to slow the rate of growth of bacteria, viruses and other similar organisms that can spread infections.

My experience has been that going outside in the cold (-15C) with only minimal layers of protection did not cause a cold. I did however notice how, if I was sitting in a hot bus next to the cold window, such that only part of my body was cold (like the right arm), I would start to feel ill.

Anyone have bright ideas on how to convince someone that this is true? My wife absolutely believes that not dressing warmly enough will make you sick, and it drives me mildly crazy.

I'm afraid it's probably just too rooted in tradition. My parter and her mother are Russian, and Russians hold to this theory like you wouldn't believe - if the two of them had it their way, I'd be bundled up and ready to go to Oymyakon even if it's 5C out. :)

I appreciate their concern of course, but it's just one of those long-lasting ideas that has little sway, despite my partner getting sick far more often than me while dressing up with far more during cold snaps than I do.

On the plus side, борщ every day once it starts getting cold.

My wife is Chinese and the Chinese seem to have a crazy amount of medical superstitions. This is the one that bugs me the most, but there are so many bizarre rules she tries to follow.

It's interesting because her family is, for the most part, educated, rational, and sane. But certain things.... I guess it's tradition, like you say. Makes me wonder what crazy stuff I believe.

You are more likely to catch a cold when the weather is cold, because people stay inside more, viruses live longer in living spaces during dry winter conditions, etc.

You are not more likely to catch a cold when you yourself get cold or chilled, as shown by the 1958 randomized trial and other experiments.

The article's title ought to be amended to make it clear that the latter situation is being discussed.

Here are some assumptions I've made that make me think being cold does increase the chance of illness:

• Feeling cold increases stress. ⇒ Stress weakens the immune system.

• Being cold expends energy. ⇒ Fighting a virus requires energy.

• Being cold increases blood pressure. ⇒ High blood pressure is not conductive to good health.

• The cold reduces circulation. ⇒ Reduced circulation is detrimental to health.

If only someone had reviewed the actual research on the subject and written an article about it.

The research isn't conclusive. The research about stress, blood pressure and circulation is much more so.

I used to have cold mostly in winter for years. But i self-discovered that it was allergy which started with a couple of sneeze and went to take the form of cold and cough in couple of days. So, now whenever I feel like I am about to get cold(disease), I take allegra and boom it doesn't go further than that sneeze.

Do you know against what you had the allergic reaction? Because most season based allergies are during summer with grass pollen and the like.

I'm asking because my daughter also has allergy in winter, but they didn't discover against what (no dust-mites or anything like that)

I would suspect first, in the winter, mold/mildew -- including the foods list in link here. https://www.achooallergy.com/learning/mold-allergies-in-wint... . Tho, i'm sure you tested for that as well... hope you find the trigger.

I have also found that most typical minor "cold" symptoms for me stop immediately by taking Claritin D. I suspect its drying out things in the sinuses, and reducing some inflammation.

> Do you know against what you had the allergic reaction?

Not sure really, could be pollen, as in the morning my window used to open at around 6am and I would start sneezing or sudden change of weather - like If I would go out in sun and drink cold water I used to get cold. Messed up one crucial exam paper because of that :( . I wish I had discovered allegra before.

I have the same "cold" allergy. I can walk into a room that is 10 degrees F cooler than, say, "normal indoor temperature" and if my quads/thighs are uncovered (shorts, for ex.), I will immediately start sneezing.

For me it is usually cold dry air that seems to cause post-nasal drip. Once I get that, it's a good chance I will get a sore throat, and it goes from there.

Being outdoors is usually fine, but sleeping under a strong AC or driving in the cold with windows down is almost a sure fire way to get this started.

I absolutely don't know if this is true: but my doctor once said that your nose and cavities are having their 'period' every 6 weeks or so, just to clean up. Most people don't even notice this. But this is when you are most vulnerable to viruses.

Maybe someone know if this is true.

Part of the perception might be that people do get runny noses and sneeze more in cold weather (at least I do). That feels a bit like having a cold so our minds might connect them and subconsciously feel it's the same thing.

I thought it was basically that your body is spending more energy keeping your body warm, and not as much defending yourself from cooties. So you get sick from lowered immune system response.

ah ah, this sound paradoxal! But it just because in english a cold is called a cold and not something less connoted like nasopharyngitis.

Not just in English. In Russian it's called "простуда" (coldness). In Japanese it's "kaze" (wind). Spanish "resfriado" (cooled). And so on.

Polish "przeziębienie", which would roughly translate to 'state of being thoroughly overcooled'.

Dutch as well "verkoudheid" (koud) is cold

Slovak "prechladnutie" is also derived from "chlad", meaning cold.

i find cold increases your immunity. whenever i feel getting sick, i jump in a cold bathfor abbout a minute. it is something i been testing for past few years and i can say it seems to work about 80% of the time.

sometines you just need to put some shock on your body to wake up your immune system. i feel this is an area we haven't researched enough.

From the article:

It has been postulated that when it’s cold, people tend to congregate inside. This behavior makes it easier, of course, for viruses to be spread from person to person

I've always thought this to be the case, and if true, then cold does increase the odds of catching a cold.

Is there any work showing correlation with Vitamin D status?

Rousseau said the same thing in his book Emile.

Go outside on cold day. Don't dress for it. Come home. Have cold.

Think have enough data.

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