That said, I take it as a given that any app I install on my phone is probably tracking my usage of their app. Dropping in Mixpanel or Heap or some other analytics lib that tracks feature usage seems like such a standard part of developing a mobile app, I'd be surprised if a developer didn't do it.
Bought the toy, found the bluetooth connection was almost hilariously bad, gave up on it, but sort of assumed they were recording usage data and analytics because that's what you do.
It's odd, there's all these privacy and security scandals going on, and nobody seems to care about them. And then here it turns out that a mobile app that I logged into into is actually logging stuff, like every mobile app ever, and it's a huge scandal and a lawsuit and now a settlement?
I don't get it. I'm not even sure I understand what they were did that was wrong. I could understand a lawsuit over how crap their bluetooth was (I can't stress enough just how horrible it was), but over the fact that their mobile app logged usage? Really?
Newsflash: When you buy a vibrator from a vendor, they know you're going to use it. That's what people do with them. What next, a lawsuit that Amazon is tracking your purchases on Amazon? Man, do you think Facebook might have some logs of what you click on in the Facebook app?
The original complaint states:
* "Defendant never informed Plaintiff that it would monitor, collect, and transmit her Usage Information."
* "Plaintiff never provided her consent to Defendant to monitor, collect, and transmit her Usage Information."
* "Plaintiff would never have purchased a We-Vibe had she known that in order to use its full functionality, Defendant would monitor, collect, and transmit her Usage Information through We-Connect."
The claims were based on potential violations of: "Wiretap Act", "Illinois Eavesdropping Act", "Illinois Consumer Fraud and Deceptive Business Practice Act;", "intrusion upon seclusion" and "unjustly enriched through its conduct."
Of particular interest to me was the "Wiretap" angle--my understanding is that the suit claimed that--because analytics were transmitted over the internet even when the app was used solo--the company was unlawfully intercepting the customer's command being transmitted over Bluetooth between the phone and device.
Human bodies make great faraday cages.
> analytics lib that tracks feature usage seems like such a standard part of developing a mobile app
Right, and we talked about this in a follow-up TEDx talk: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxRSjC1rPmA Just because analytics are a standard practice doesn't mean they should be a standard practice for any particular product.
Developers for more personal/intimate devices need to recognise the impact their data collection may have; that different people have different "Device Intimacy Spectrums" (e.g. people who live in places where adult toys are illegal will be more concerned about what is collected); and, gain informed consent for any data they collect.
I suspect the company would actually have prevailed. You didn't have to use the app, and the click-through almost certainly had the correct legal language. Precedent would also be on their side.
I also suspect the negative press and legal fees would be more than the profit they made on these vibrators. If we assume $100 of profit on each on we're only talking roughly 40,000 units sold.
The claim of the original suit stated that it wasn't and didn't. And, after the original press coverage of our DEF CON talk, the company updated its policies to be more transparent about what it was doing.
> You didn't have to use the app True, but the company specifically sold an "app-only" version (that had no physical remote control unit) and the original suit claimed that the company justified its premium price in part because it was app connected.
> I also suspect the negative press and legal fees would be more than the profit they made on these vibrators. > If we assume $100 of profit on each on we're only talking roughly 40,000 units sold.
From the article: "An estimated 300,000 people bought Bluetooth-enabled WeVibes..."
I find that hugely suspect. That would imply almost a $60-90 million business (those things are expensive for a vibrator).
That's a bit off from the financials of "Standard Innovation" the parent corp.
I wasn't able to find any financials for the company in a quick Google except this CNBC quote from 2013, before the We-Vibe 4 app-enabled product came out:
> We-Vibe, which retails for $79-$170, has been one of those big hits. Over the past five years, the device has amassed cumulative sales of $100 million. And it's gaining momentum. In 2012, the company says, annual sales were 50 percent higher than the preceding year—and the company had revenues of $35 million. It expects those revenues to land between $45 million and $50 million this calendar year.
$100 million in sales translates to about 300,000-500,000 units. So, the numbers would be consistent.
I actually don't care, I just found it funny that you're posting under your real name without shame. It's refreshing, but I think it's also one of the ways techies are significantly different than the rest of the population.
Yeah but who wants to listen to people that would judge stuff like a couple buying a toy.
Isn't the supposed demand for discretion the whole point, the rest of the thread seems to be taking as read that people don't want anyone to find out about their vibrator use - yet here we are and [some of] the people actually affected want us all to know they used the device.
CoolGuySteve's comment seems apposite. Of course his last sentence may be correct but that's to be shown.