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Comment by smbullet | Hacker News Reader

Don't you think you could better promote change by working for the system rather than being a dissident outside the system? Everytime I see threads that talk about "bad apples" I find it strange that I never see comments that encourage getting "good apples" to apply.

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I've thought about it. I've even contended in debates that if society restored respect for civil service the situation would likely improve.

Anecdotally I've known multiple people pretty well before they became cops. They were all good people and believed everyone had rights. Then, the gang mentality set in. Now is "us" versus "them". It got to the point where I no longer associate with them.

It sure is a tough problem.

I ran into an old work acquaintance a while back and he was wearing a new prison guard uniform. I blurted out, "Oh no! You've gone over to the dark side!"

Authority figures are regularly given a sort of indoctrination on induction. It's us vs them, they're criminal scum, etc etc. You can't have a civil conversation with a cop, even an off-duty one, about how criminals might be driven to criminal acts by things beyond their control and how they're still people. They simply choose that lifestyle and therefore are unequivocally The Bad Guys. It's in the entire culture, one person isn't going to change it. I do generally dislike cops, and I know there are still some good ones - but they're holdouts, and even they usually only hold out so far or so long before they fold to the cultural expectation for them to be overbearing bullies and thugs. Good people don't become good cops, good people lose themselves becoming cops.

> Everytime I see threads that talk about "bad apples" I find it strange that I never see comments that encourage getting "good apples" to apply.

Are you serious? Or being sarcastic?

The whole point of the "bad apples" metaphor is that the bad apples cause the good apples to rot.

https://www.usingenglish.com/reference/idioms/one+bad+apple....

Plenty of "good apples" apply, but are spoilt.

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