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Comment by blkhawk | Hacker News Reader

<rant>

Sadly its extremely hard to buy any Pi Zero at the sticker price. Its always out or not available - and even if you can get em you only can order a limited amount (in the case were I got lucky it was 1).

The Pi Zero W seems to continue the trend as far as my local distributor is concerned. I get the overpriced USB hubs its where the profit is at but MAN stop frigging teasing its annoying if you can't buy it at that price.

I don't want the adapters - I solder to the board directly and while the sandisk sd card is not terrible its far from the fastest you can get for a similar price.

</rant>

sorry about that I am calm now.

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80k units on sale today from a whole bunch of new retailers around the world, and we're making 25k units /week.

cool - can't get the bare Pi Zero w in germany yet - maybe supplies will normalize in a few weeks - It would be a swap in replacement for my current handheld Project.

I ordered two from the pi3g shop listed on the site. Seemed to work fine so far.

So, how is the competitive with Xunlong and FriendlyARM making the OrangePi Zero and the Nanopi Neo? It seems to have less I/O and still not have a libre stack, unlike the Allwinner H3.

Is the Raspberry Pi Foundation just coasting on branding at this point to sell products?

Edit: On another note, will the Raspberry Pi Foundation stick with this very limited SOC ad infinium? It seems like a poor choice for a single board computer, you really want I/O and low power usage, but it doesn't deliver on either.

> Is the Raspberry Pi Foundation just coasting on branding at this point to sell products?

I don't believe beating competition by selling more products was ever part of the RPi Foundation mission statement. The way how I see it, existence of competing products primarily benefits a minority technically-oriented community, not their intended primary audience.

Eh, it seems like the Raspberry Pi Foundation has strayed from an org that started out building SBCs so kids could have a computer to tinker on, and are now entirely focused on being Broadcom's PR and Sales engine. The system on a module was definitely not created with kids in mind, nor was the open GPU driver.

Kids don't care that a Broadcom SoC powers the RPi, nor do they care about kernel level nuances. I believe you've conflated the interests of a minority hacker community with the RPi Foundation's overarching mission of making an affordable compute platform accessible to those who otherwise can't afford one for the purpose of furthering the advancement of education.

O_o Well, I really don't know what to say to you, if your ever in Seattle gimme a holler and I'll introduce you to a room full of kids who are not fans of low quality, closed software.

And I'll raise you a school full of kids who couldn't care less.

And those kids who couldn't care less probably have never used Linux or a single board computer.

Not just branding - also Pi fans at sites like Hackaday which downplay and dismiss any competing boards. For example, compare Brian Benchoff's article a year ago which argues the C.H.I.P. has been rendered irrelevant because it's $9 and the Pi Zero is $5 while ignoring the fact one has WiFi, with his article today arguing that this is a major step forward because $10 with WiFi is really cheaper than $5 without it while omitting any mention of the similarly-priced boards with WiFi that preceded it:

http://hackaday.com/2016/02/28/introducing-the-raspberry-pi-...

http://hackaday.com/2017/02/28/10-raspberry-pi-zero-w-the-w-...

I bought 2 CHIPs, disappointed. Spec sheet is perfect, but it's not raspberry pi. glitches (sudden full system shutdown when servo turns a little bit faster), and lack of quality drivers/software to work reliably.

If you need a raspberry pi, just buy a raspberry pi.

The CHIP had ridiculous postage fees, CHIP + the keyboard/display thingy would've been close to 100€ to get here.

Not worth it.

Extremely competitive.

The WiFi on the OPi Zero and Neo Air are awful; borderline unusable. (You're talking ~3Mbit in a non-noisy environment with poor range).

The Pi Zero W has the same chip as the model B which has an excellent reputation.

That's nice, but if I can't get ten, and it's "$10 plus $30 shipping", then it's just $40, isn't it. Let me get ten for $130, and then I'll believe the price.

As I mentioned in another comment, you can get one for $18 shipped from a UK seller (The Pi Hut): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13753174

Max order quantity is 1, though.

I bought one from them and they were around 15 euros total, thank you!

Not everyone lives where you do, so advertising the price for "this is how much it costs to send to StavrosK assuming they buy nothing else" would probably be less useful than giving the item price.

Hello benn_88, but will it be possible to order or preorder more than one? Maybe hundreds? Maybe at a different price tag? The RPI zero was interesting but very hard to get by.

They have a 30x PI 0 W bundle and a PI 0 W kit on sale at https://buyzero.de/collections/raspberry-pi-zero-kits

However the price for the 30x is so high that it must include every single extra component 30 times.

I disagree with parts of this. Geographical limits do mean some places end up paying more, and some scummy distributors only stock the packs with a higher markup, but on the whole, the boards are available on their own at the right price.

Your real problem is availability. You see a product launch, want 10, 100, 1000 to use in everything from the sprinklers to the toaster and then hit a website where 200,000 other hackers have had exactly the same thought. They're ferociously popular...

So what would you rather? They hold off sales and announcement until they have a million units rotting in warehouses around the world (like a console release)? Perhaps they should spend twice as much ramping up production to burst in the first month (and charge more). Or pre-orders? Kickstarter? Serious here, what option is better (on price, fairness and convenience to you) than what they're currently doing?

In a month or two you'll (again, slightly dependant on geography) be able to order a hundred of these without an issue. If you really are putting in a big order, talk direct to the distributor and they can adjust their order (and maybe their price to you).

Ultimately you don't have to pay more, you just have to be patient.

I don't think the one per customer limit on the original Pi Zero ever got lifted in the entire year and a bit it's been on sale, with the brief exception of ones sold in a $40 bundle with the camera module. It's probably sensible to assume that you will never be able to buy more than one of these at once for anything close to the list price.

I bought a Pi Zero last week from The Pi Hut, arrived in two days, they had loads in stock. Might be a problem with your local distributor? I'm in the UK so supply may well be better here than elsewhere.

I did get tripped up with the camera connector being a different size to normal Pis though, darn it.

[1] www.thepihut.com (I am not affiliated with them in any way)

Ya I ordered it from the UK in the end - postage was annoyingly expensive and I also ordered from the Pi Hut.

How much was shipping?

£2.50 for a £30 order

That's not too bad, but did you get the combo package? What happens if you try to get the single Pi? Would it be 12.50 total?

Yes, it's £9.60 for the RPi Zero W and £2.50 for shipping. You can buy it for £12.10 ($15) total in the UK. Not too bad, eh?

Shipping to Germany from the same UK seller would be £4, or £5 for the US. That's a total of £13.60 / €16 / $17 for Germany and £14.60 / $18 for the US.

You can stop pretending that shipping is $30 now.

On Pimoroni, shipping to Switzerland is also around £4. In contrast, the official distributor for Germany/Switzerland (pi3g) wants 19€ (!!!) for shipping an envelope with a single Pi Zero in it. And it prohibits reselling. In my opinion the Raspberry Pi foundation should do something against this kind of pricing to keep the boards accessible.

Yes pi3g is terrible. Kiwi Electronics (Netherlands) seems very reasonable (€15.50 to Germany), along with The Pi Hut (UK, ca €16).

Thank you, both of those shipped with very reasonable rates. I've bought a Pi Zero W, thanks!

Lucky you, then. Shipping is $25 for me, to Greece.

Same situation as you - pi zero is always out of stock. But in the video included in the post they are saying they will manufacture a lot more quantities of this compared to pi zero so fingers crossed.

This brings up a question I've been meaning to ask: how hard is it to solder a 40 pin connector to a Pi Zero. Do you need a temperature controlled soldering iron?

its not hard at all - a 10EUR iron will do frankly if you aren't a complete spaz :)

the pin spacing is just as large as with the "grownup" RPI

just don't use lead-free solder - no good reason for it and it makes soldering harder than it need be.

well, apart from not wanting lead poisoning

not a problem with lead solder. I prefer not getting cancer from the flux in the lead free solder.

How do you avoid it with lead solder? Common soldering tutorials don't mention the issue.

Because lead poisoning isn't a huge issue for hobbyists.

Common rules are: Work in a well-ventilated area, don't eat while working, don't use your soldering iron to heat your coffee. But those apply while using lead-free solder as well.

Why is it not an issues, the dosage is too low? Afaik lead enters through the skin, too - washing hands after soldering sufficient?

Real answer: you would have to be soldering for hours every day for months to be exposed to more lead than can be cleared naturally. Full-time component assembly workers do get that much exposure, so they need to take precautions to avoid poisoning. For hobbyists, you would have to eat quite a bit of solder at once before you would develop any poisoning symptoms.

edit: so, it's the frequent repeated exposure to lead (i.e. in paint and as a sugar added to wine[0]) which is harmful, not any single individual (non-acute) exposure.

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead(II)_acetate#Sweetener

heavy metal leaching in rubbish tips is an environmental issue, one being tackled by much of Europe, starting with regulations on lead-containing electronics.

And since almost all electronics are made in large quantities for sale, it makes sense that there can be different rules for one-offs.

Don't eat the solder? Warning: Pregnant women, the elderly, and children under 10 should avoid prolonged exposure to lead-based solder. Caution: lead-based solder may suddenly accelerate to dangerous speeds. Lead-based solder contains a liquid core, which, if exposed due to rupture, should not be touched, inhaled, or looked at. Do not use lead-based solder on concrete. Discontinue use of lead-based solder if any of the following occurs:

    itching
    vertigo
    dizziness
    tingling in extremities
    loss of balance or coordination
    slurred speech
    temporary blindness
    profuse sweating
    or heart palpitations.

If lead-based solder begins to smoke, get away immediately. Seek shelter and cover head. Lead-based solder may stick to certain types of skin. When not in use, lead-based solder should be returned to its special container and kept under refrigeration. Failure to do so relieves the makers of lead-based solder, Wacky Products Incorporated, and its parent company, Global Chemical Unlimited, of any and all liability. Ingredients of lead-based solder include an unknown glowing green substance which fell to Earth, presumably from outer space. Lead-based solder has been shipped to our troops in Saudi Arabia and is being dropped by our warplanes on Iraq. Do not taunt lead-based solder. Lead-based solder comes with a lifetime warranty.

What are you doing with it, eating it?

It so happens the lead-free solder needs more heat, more heat leads to longer solder times, killing more components, or damaging their lifespan, forcing you to breath more of the extra toxic lead-free flux fumes. Do not use lead-free solder for hobby work.

Any electronics containing lead must be disposed on safely, meaning you can't just sell or distribute such items.

Why bother make disposal hard for the sake of easy soldering?

10EUR irons are terrible! You have to be far more skilled to deliver the right amount of heat, and for some cases (small pad close to a chip without a shunt) it's hard to solder well without causing damage. They can also be pretty inconsistent temp-wise, making precise, skilled timings impossible.

You can just hammer one in. No. I'm not joking.

https://learn.pimoroni.com/tutorial/sandyj/fitting-hammer-he...

I bought one PI Zero W from the Dutch distributor a few minutes ago. It's linked in the blog post. I didn't have to buy anything else and I couldn't buy more than one item.

The German distributor seems to be selling only 30x items and the French one doesn't have an Add to cart button for the W, maybe still out of stock. It's in stock at Pimoroni. I didn't check any distributor outside EU.

I've been happy with SanDisk microSDHC UHS-I 8 GB cards so far. They are cat 10, advertised up to 48 MB/s. Which SD cards do you recommend?

I used to use them as well - but I had some fail for some reason and then I bought a samsung evo + card in 32GB during a sale. I have been using those ever since since the iops seem to be noticeably better.

This?

https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Class-Adapter-MB-MP32DA-AM/dp...

This might be useable: http://whereismypizero.com/

Only covers regular pi zero though.

Yeah. For a dinky little raspi zero board...

$10 shipping. CanaKIT. Nope.

4-12 pounds shipping for PiHut.

5.50 - 8 pounds shipping for pimoroni.

Aaaand you can't even get a bare Pi Zero from Adafruit. Of course they're "out of stock" for the "W"'s... But they're glad to sell you a overly inflated price of $24.95 for a Zero kit. bah.

I eventually gave up and ordered my Pi Zero from eBay scalpers. Will probably have to do that with the Zero W as well.

If they're already for sale at brick-and-mortars then the listings won't be far behind (I don't see any yet, though).

I bought two Zeros for $5 and <$5 of shipping earlier this month. I still had to go to two different distributors, but Canakit and Adafruit were in stock in the US.

I'm more interest in trying the Asus Tinker right now then a wireless Zero, still cool though. Might you have any special knowledge on this alleged Pi-Killer ? https://www.asus.com/uk/Single-board-Computer/TINKER-BOARD/

Here's a cool link for you pointing to some new mitochondria research, http://www.cell.com/molecular-cell/fulltext/S1097-2765(16)00...

If you want 0 problem ordering one, you can just subscribe to resellers newsletters

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