Reflecting on Susan Fowler’s Reflections | Hacker News Reader

Reflecting on Susan Fowler’s Reflections

medium.com

19 pointsNimsical5 comments

I have a lot of mixed feelings about this. I think sexism is a problem. I think Uber probably is much worse. I like that she discussed this. I recognize this as a problem generally, but I don't understand the:

We thought it was hilarious and joked about it for weeks.

This was disgusting.

Obviously, it was super unprofessional, careless and stupid of a manager to hang out and drink w/ under aged interns. Given she wasn't an employee and it was mostly verbal harassment, I think it was sloppy and rude. However, getting hammered is sloppy.

I guess on balance, I have a higher tolerance for this stuff in society but I can understand the author's points as she is much more reasonable than most. Fowler as well.

The only thing I can't grep is retroactively doing a 180 on the sentiment of an event. Sure, maybe after a short period, like that manager probably did when he woke up thinking wtf have I done. But it doesn't sound particularly vile or threatening if it was a joke for everyone involved.

Either way, Uber has some culture issues. Tech does as well, and Uber sounds like a tough place to be a femsle

Yeah I have mixed feelings about it too. It's hard to draw the lines between respectful flirting and harassment sometimes. Just purely from her saying it was funny then, it seems like it was closer to respectful flirting.

> The only thing I can't grep is retroactively doing a 180 on the sentiment of an event.

When it's convenient for her to change her mind, she does so. That's all there is to it. Which is exactly why whoever was in charge of that manager at Google didn't tolerate the man drinking with the underage intern girl and trying to get in her pants. Imagine the shit he'd have to deal with if drinking manager succeeded in sleeping with her, and then the next morning she decides she regrets it. Or a week later she tells one of her friends who disapproves and then she regrets it.

Under no circumstances should a company tolerate an employee making sexual advances toward a subordinate.

He was older and in a position of power. She was young and an intern. What initially seemed funny changed after some time because she got older and got some context and understood why it was inappropriate and unacceptable. The manager that overheard the jokes understood the context and what could have happened, which is what a manager should do.

Is it really so surprising that someone can over time process an event and see it for what it actually was, rather than how they first reacted to it?

The most damning part of Fowler's statement is how unlike her experience is to that of the author:

1. The sexual incident was verbally communicated, took place off site and after hours versus using corporate communication at work during work hours.

2. The corporate standards for behavior were higher and independent of what a particular woman might or might not find out of line.

3. Human resources uncovered and acted upon the violation of behavioral standards without the women filing a complaint.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com