Android Nougat 7.1.2 Beta is out now for Pixel and Nexus 5X | Hacker News Reader

Android Nougat 7.1.2 Beta is out now for Pixel and Nexus 5X

android-developers.googleblog.com

I couldn't care less with Android's fragmentation getting worse, not better. See https://developer.android.com/about/dashboards/index.html - less than 1% is on 7.0+ a year after its announcement.

My Nexus 5 (2013), fully under control of Google, didn't get even 7.0 (2016). Moto G4 (2016) I bought few months ago is on 6.0 (2015), might get 7.0 (2016) soon-ish. I basically stopped caring about new versions, buying new phones to get the latest, etc. They are not even as exciting as they used to be, feature-wise.

edited: Nexus 5 actually got 6.0

I think API-wise the most important improvements were done with Kitkat and the 4.x series. Targetting that will get you pretty much all the users you need. So it's not as bad as when 4.x was new and the majority of users were on 2.x.

That said, I agree it's hard to be enthusiastic about a new Android-release these days. It's even harder to find out what new stuff (which isn't tied to US-only offered Google services) which you have in store as a user.

On the bright side, that's probably a sign of a previously immature platform finally maturing.

Targeting API 19+ (4.4) for most apps is more than realistic and that buys you proper RTL support and rather powerful devices.

If you want to push UI to the limits, API 21 (5.0+) will still cover most of the market with great Material and elevation APIs.

It's a mess, isn't it. I'm still on an HTC One M7 (2013) with 5.0. And I'm a software developer who just sticks it on the business.

I was all set to get the new Nexus, looking forward to the marginally quicker software upgrades (or even, some software upgrades now they've stopped on EE in the UK) and then they announce the Pixel. With the higher price bracket I can't see it getting the volumes, which means even more fragmentation.

I don't want an iPhone, especially with the mess they're making with Macbook Pros but it's looking like the sane option.

> I don't want an iPhone, especially with the mess they're making with Macbook Pros but it's looking like the sane option.

In case you start seriously considering that option, let me provide you with a story of what to expect.

I ditched my Android for an iPhone SE, because clearly no Android-vendor wants to create a small premium-class device which receives software updates and which can be used with one hand. And Apple makes the iPhone SE, so I figured I should put my money where my mouth was.

My experience with iPhone is a bit schizofrenic. What works, works really well (especially the camera!), but everywhere on the platform you notice shortcomings and artificial limitations which limits your ability to get things done.

It's clearly targetted towards CEOs whose peak complexity-needs are checking their email. Professional/power users who wants to use the phone as a platform for getting things done are completely ignored as far as needs and capabilities go.

And don't get me started about the complete lack of quality software in the geek-department (Github, Travis, SSH, IRC, etc). It's a complete fucking wasteland. Right now I'm using all those apps through the web instead. Through Firefox. Which I cannot set as a system-wide default browser. Because no such thing exists. Same for SMS, so now I need to check Signal and the built in messaging app.

It's maddening.

So right now my iPhone is a device for checking web-pages and email. There's just no apps which covers my professional needs. I know all the iDevice-owners were screaming from the hills how much better apps are on iPhone than on Android, but I just can't see it. At least for me, it's been a downgrade for every app-category I use.

So like I said, what works works well enough for me to keep this thing. But at the same time I keep wondering if I should pick up my old Nexus 5X and give it a second chance...

So yeah. If you make the switch, and have any sense of geekyness in you, expect the switch to be painful. The grass is definitely not all green.

You may want to consider the Blackberry Mercury when it's released in late February. It can be used with one hand (due to its keyboard) and Blackberry have been excellent in releasing Android security fixes -- sometimes even before Google make them available.

How good is blackberrys track record with their first android?

I'm not a bb guy but I might buy one if I switch to android next.

The priv was okay. The keyboard is nice, BB's addon software is really good, but the hardware is decidedly middle of the road for a flagship, the camera is crap, and the build quality ranges from middling to bad, depending on which reviews you read. Oh, and you can forget about rooting. They've been very good about security updates, even with Verizon's legendary ass-dragging.

For SSH, I've used Prompt and iSSH on my iDevices. Prompt seems nicer, but iSSH has a built-in X server which makes for some interesting possibilities. Prompt has some integration with 1Password, but I haven't explored it much.

There are things that make SSH from iDevices a pain though, such as the 10-minute limit on background tasks. This can be overcome by using screen/tmux, or by using Mosh instead of SSH (I haven't tried Mosh yet), but it's still annoying.

One thing that BlackBerry did right and I wish iOS would copy is the Unified Inbox. Your messages from any app that did messaging would get funneled into the Unified Inbox. So Signal, Messages, SMS, Mail, Facebook, etc would all get funneled into one place. It was really neat and really made the BlackBerry useful as a communications tool.

I could not be happier with the Termux Linux environment for Android.

From what I can tell, you have to buy a new phone, otherwise you'll be stuck with a device that doesn't get critical security updates.

iPhone SE is a somewhat viable option, it's quite new so it will be supported for a while, and doesn't have the big price of either iPhone7 or Pixel.

edit: Just want to say that new features at this point is not that interesting IMHO, security updates on the other hand, that is what makes a difference.

Not sure where you got the idea that the Nexus 5 didn't get Android 6. I still have the Nexus 5 and got Android 6. It was also still getting security updates until December last year [0].

Android 7 was only announced in Match last year too, and wasn't released until August, 5 months later, so it's not even been out for 6 months yet.

Personally, I've switched to LineageOS which is on Android 7.1 and that is working fine (although I understand that installing ROMs isn't going to work for the vast majority of people). With a Google branded phone getting ROM support is more likely to be supported for those that care about it, otherwise 'normal' people will just get a new phone every 1-2 years when their contract is up for renewal.

I don't really agree with this, but 2 years of OS upgrades and 3 years of OS security fixes (from Google for their phones) seems 'okay' and is better than what most other phone manufactures (of Android phones) offer.

[0] https://developers.google.com/android/images#hammerheadm4b30... (6.0.1 (M4B30Z, Dec 2016))

Wow, you are absolutely right. I must have not noticed I got it at some point :|

> I don't really agree with this, but 2 years of OS upgrades and 3 years of OS security fixes (from Google for their phones) seems 'okay' and is better than what most other phone manufactures (of Android phones) offer.

Considering 2 years of security and bug fixes post sale, not post launch, is required under EU law (see EU warranty directive, any defect already existing during manufacturing that affects hardware or software has to be fixed for at least 2 years past sale), this isn’t actually that great – this is still in many cases less than the legal minimum.

Sorry, should've said that the security releases are 3 years after release or 18 months from the time they were removed from the Google Store [0]. So as a minimum they get 1 year more than required by EU law.

Like I said, I don't really agree with it, but Google do seem a bit above the average. And personally, so long as I can install custom ROMs afterwards, I'm okay with 3 years of official updates.

[0]: https://support.google.com/nexus/answer/4457705#nexus_device...

Fragmentation robs all joy from maintaining an Android application. The majority of bug reports I get I can't reproduce, because the bug doesn't occur in a simulated version of the same Android version, and I don't own the particular hardware device in question.

I know that feel :-(

This isn't entirely Google's fault. A lot of smartphones use Qualcomm's baseband chips which require kernel drivers. But Qualcomm refuses to port their driver over to newer kernel and so every device is stuck with a specific kernel version for its lifetime. So you might have Android 7.1 but the kernel is still 3.10 even though the actual kernel in Android 7.1 should be 4.4. This is often (not always) because Qualcomm's driver is only compatible with 3.10 and Qualcomm wants to be paid a lot of money to change this.

Live by the sword, die by the sword. (Users shouldn't have to care that Google made a design decision which puts control over their platform in the hands of a third party like this, in other words)

Qualcomm used illegal monopolistic practices to establish their dominant position. They're being fined and sued for billions for it but in the meantime the damage is done, we are all suffering.

> Qualcomm used illegal monopolistic practices to establish their dominant position

Allegedly. Or did I miss a ruling?

Final rulings have come down in China and South Korea. Other jurisdictions with active investigations include Europe, Taiwan and the US.

Is there a reason Apple aren't vulnerable?

There is zero coordination between Google, Linux devs and Qualcomm (and Samsung et al). Why are you then surprised that this happens???

I have had Nougat on my Nexus 5 for several months. It's smooth, good battery life, but it's an unofficial ROM. To update, you need to reflash. Why is it not from Google? It's clearly possible to do...

Do we have a choice right now? Not asking that rhetorically, is there actually a manufacturer left who makes decent Android phones that don't use a Qualcomm chipset, because I agree this bullshit needs to end.

You decided to reward Motorola with money for not updating. Why should "Google care more" about you when you decided to give money to manufacturer which doesn't update software?

My Nexus 9 runs 7.1.1. My Nexus 5X runs 7.1.1. My Pixel XL runs 7.1.1. Vote with your wallet or complain instead of giving money to OEMs that screw you.

The Nexus/Pixel devices are expensive and don't have SD card expansion. It'd be nice to have cheap, SD card and updates. I don't think any phone covers all that nowadays.

I had Galaxy Nexus, Nexus 5, and both Nexus 7s. I tried really hard to stick to it for exactly your reason, but all those devices stopped getting updates long before they stopped working anyway. Pixel is a ridiculously expensive thing and I don't trust it will get more than just this year's android.

Release notes don't really say a whole lot:

https://developer.android.com/preview/support-712.html

Anyone know what has actually changed?

Yeah, it only tells us known issues. Gee, thanks.

And I just checked for updates, none available. Some transparency into when exactly it's available for beta users would be nice. Is this kind of weirdness the new normal?

> Anyone know what has actually changed?

This is annoying with Google and Android. The betas are completely closed-source, so digging around in the actual Android-repos won't give you any leads either.

I didn't dig too deep, but latest tag I could find in the currently published repos is "android-7.1.1_r13".

https://android.googlesource.com/platform/bionic/+/android-7...

Last time I joined the Android Beta Program (for 7.1.1), Google removed the the Night mode feature. No thanks, I'm done with early releases removing features that were otherwise working well in previous versions.

What an infuriating post -- it doesn't link to the changelog.

Still no Pixel in France and most of the world though. I guess I'll go for an iphone then. Too bad, that Pixel looked good.

I must say, since getting 7.0 on my 5X, battery life has improved a lot. It could barely make a full workday on 6.0, but now it will last almost two days of average use.

I wouldn't even think of installing this beta, they don't give me any reason to. Maybe if they would fix the contact syncing with non-Google providers, or something.

Maybe if they would fix the contact syncing with non-Google providers, or something.

I have found serious bugs with syncing contacts to Google's servers. I found that the web version of contacts didn't have a bunch of changes I made to a contact on my phone, so now every time I make changes on my phone I look and rarely are they on the web contacts.

I started a case with Google (I have a 5x, so I'm supported) and go to the point they wanted me to factory reset rather than find the bug. I said no thanks. I even pleaded that that would just mask the bug and didn't they want to find the problem? After all, I was completely stock (I didn't even unlock the bootloader).

I didn't know it was that broken. I always assumed my Android Contact problems came from using Office 365 Exchange with Outlook as the main source of my contact list, with many years of history in it.

Going from 7.1 to 7.1.1 on my Nexus 6p has ruined my battery life. Light web browsing for 1 hour in the morning while playing radio with TuneIn always cost me 10-12% of my battery. Since 7.1.1 it has cost me 30% of my battery. The battery drain has been insane. I've reset permissions and tried to track down what's causing this, but I can't find a culprit.

Don't know about the 6p, but on both my old 2013 Moto X and my current Nexus 5x, I've had to manually reboot the phone an additional time after completing an update. Until I do this, some Google service consumes an inordinate amount of battery -- dropping the battery charge 10% or so an hour while the phone is idling.

That is, I do the update. The phone restarts as part of the update, yada-yada... Ok, I'm officially all done with the update. No more reboots. But this service is eating battery like crazy. Manually power the phone all the way off, once more, and then restart. Finally, battery use goes back to normal, and in Settings this Google service no longer headlines as the primary power consumer.

i'm hoping the wait for the Nexus 6P beta here is due to fixing the "connections with car bluetooth" issue :(

Good lord, yes. That has been horrible. Mine was working fine before 7.1.1, but broke at that point. Apparently others have been having it since long before that, too.

People blaming carries and manufacturers for late updates:

Is there any other product where the manufacturer must redo half of the product at the whim of a third party?

Google needs to work with these companies, not as it is today throw a pile of random changes on them every six months. Most of all, there needs to be a grand plan and an understanding about what will be changed next (and why).

Maybe. On the other hand if the manufacturers changed less when they "apply" Android to their phones updates would be easier, but instead of providing a default Android every manufacturer tries to be the "best" Android variant (sometimes with more success, sometimes with less success) and then they say "hey, we've sold it already, updates? Nope. No interest."

This is simply not true. The amount of time updating "skins" add to the development is relatively small. Haven't you noticed that even companies with almost stock android are having trouble keeping up with these updates?

Because most of their time is spent on the numerous low level changes for the new kernel (and how it behaves towards the firmware and completely messes up power management) and getting it past national authorities and carriers.

Source: a friend of mine does this for living

does this work with a verizon pixel? It let me enroll mine, but no update yet...

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