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Comment by tdaltonc | Hacker News Reader

I recently made an app to help with this.

We had to launch it as a web app because Apple said that "any app that encourages you to use your phone less is not appropriate for the app store" when we submitted the native version.

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Are absolutely ridiculous rules like that public somewhere or did someone make this up? And if not, the person didn't understand the point. The app is primarily about breaking the cycle of addiction to apps, not about using the phone or the apps less!

They also interpret our app as "modifying the function of other apps." We're working through the appeals process and I'm hoping that they'll see the light the way you have!

What exactly does it do?

>Space loads a Moments of Zen before apps you need space from. This short-circuits instant gratification and puts you in charge again.

So if I hit an app icon, it launches your app instead? I don't understand the details entirely, but I can see why they wouldn't want that.

Let's say you want to use facebook less.

Space creates a space-launcher icon that you put where you used to keep facebook on your home screen. Now you click the space-launcher instead of clicking facebook. The space-launcher loads a 2-12 second meditation exercise, then loads facebook.

Ok, I get it now. If that's the case then you should look at or suggest to Apple apps like Workflow and Launch Center Pro which can also be used to provide shortcuts and integrations in other apps from the home screen. Is that the kind of thing you're going for? I realize it's probably not exactly the same but maybe it's along the same lines.

Ya! That is one of our lines of reasoning almost verbatim; specifically those two apps.

> breaking the cycle of addiction to apps

Apple works hard to make their devices and apps addictive.

We're looking in to ways to solve this problem too. You're right that that's way easier on android, but we've found some tricks in iOS that might work too.

I can't wait for Android to get basic features the iPhone had in 2007, like a backup system and permission system that work properly and automatically on every app, and actual software updates. Plus a watch that's actually decent. Then I can switch away from Apple's dictatorship and not have to worry about being told what I can and can't use ever again.

Pixel is getting close, but still needs to not have insane design decisions like the weird oversized spacing of every app, and the fingerprint sensor in the stupidest place possible.

There's an automatic backup system for apps, but because of the amount of freedom Android apps have it's trivial to do things that it can't catch

I hate the whole ITunes system, and how bad it is for parents. I've found that it's simply impossible to find any time control apps to effectively monitor and restrict your child's usage patterns. Apps like Screentimelabs simply don't have the authority they require, and appear vastly better in their Android versions.

I have a 6 year old boy; I'd like to e.g. time limit games time to a set amount of time, and allow more time for apps that I have vetted positive for his learning.

Ideally I'd link N amount of productivity time to bonus time in the games category, however I'd settle for just being able to restrict overall app usage by category timers.

When/if my son's iPad breaks, it won't be replaced by a new one.

Leapfrog tablet has that, though it is a walled garden.

Amazon's Kindle stuff for kids includes limits. However, it doesn't appear to offer additional customization/filtering within the existing setup.

https://www.amazon.com/Amazon-FreeTime-Unlimited-Monthly-Sub...

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B018Y226XO

I tried it on iOS with Instagram. It worked in the sense that I followed the breathing exercise and cancelled opening Instagram. I did that exercise twice and cancelled each time. I noticed the urge to open Instagram decreased but at the same time the urge to open any other app increased to get that information high. I guess there should be a system-wide lock/delay so I cannot cheat by switching to other apps for my high. … So the best solution for me at this time would be to put the phone away and only use it in certain allowed time frames, similar to what the author does with no Internet before lunch.

As you notice a new app becoming the problem app, you can also add another space-launcher to replace it. Most people we've talked to find that there are about 3-5 apps on thier phone with 'problem potential.'

> any app that encourages you to use your phone less is not appropriate for the app store

How can this be legal?

Uh, it's their platform, their rules?

are you kidding? it's their app store. legal doesn't even enter into it.

How could it be illegal? Their app store, their rules.

That said, I think it's ridiculous.

How could this be illegal?

Why would it be illegal? If Best Buy didn't want to stock a physical product that made it easier to buy things online instead of getting them at Best Buy, why should they have to stock it?

One key distinction might be that Best Buy doesn't appear to be an open marketplace. Best Buy has to purchase from the maker, to sell, whereas app marketplaces do not purchase, they just make available. I don't know if that has any standing in court, but it's important that we recognize that the brick and mortar comparison does fail to completely encapsulate what we're talking about.

>open

>Apple

I wouldn't expect anything made by Apple to be open in any way

Swift and Darwin

Well it is Apple's store, they can pick and choose what they want to sell just like any other store.

It very well may not be, or at least subject to anti-monopoly laws.

http://www.zdnet.com/article/us-appeals-court-reopens-lawsui...

Yeah, that lawsuit is not going to go anywhere. Apple is not even close to a monopoly.

Apple is not obligated to give you any way to run any software at all on the phone they sell. Luckily the vendor whose share dominate s this market does offer you just that: a way to run any software you choose.

Let's please not pick up our anti trust pitchforks to take the minority share luxury brand to task. This behavior is not at all new btw. The app store is as restrictive as it's always been and they've never offered an "allow install from unknown sources".

If you don't like it, don't buy apple.

That's pretty cool. I would definitely buy this.

> We had to launch it as a web app because Apple said that "any app that encourages you to use your phone less is not appropriate for the app store" when we submitted the native version.

That sucks. And doesn't sound consistent. What about Forest, which Apple has featured? You pre-commit to some duration where you won't use the device (won't leave the Forest app or lock screen, anyway), while a digital tree grows, or dies if you violate the rule and joins your forest if you don't.

I visited your website. Are you here for $$$ or fot the mission to restore cumulative time of 10 lifespans every day?

Consider - https://github.com/jefferyleo/f.lux - install manually via Xcode?

It's stuff like this that really puts me off app development.

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