BBC Horizon - Psychedelic Science - DMT, LSD, Ibogaine | Hacker News Reader

BBC Horizon - Psychedelic Science - DMT, LSD, Ibogaine

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31 pointsulvund27 comments

At my studio back in Sydney we had several San Pedro cactuses (they contain mescaline and are identical to Peyote in effect) growing on the balcony. One night after taking everyone out for drinks we went back to the studio and got into them. I was lounging around talking with one of my business partners about how we didn't think it was really going to kick in. A bit later we noticed that conversation had drifted to talking about reverse entropy and why it was impossible to observe time going backward . . . at that point we knew it was working.

About twelve hours later my girlfriend dropped by (it was the next day) and I was jumping around the office telling everybody to look at my hooves. It wore off about four hours later. After a solid hunk of sleep I got up feeling ridiculously mentally refreshed.

I enjoy infrequent controlled use of hallucinogens, I find it a great mental recharge and also a pretty good time. I live in New York now and I was quite happy to see that San Pedros are even easier to get ahold of in the states than the were in Oz :)

If you've never done Peyote, it's a bit different, containing lots of different alkaloids. The effect is pretty similar though. Always depends on the person and context.

San Pedro is really easy to grow yourself, and totally legal.

I haven't actually eaten Peyote, that's interesting that there is a different effect. I wouldn't turn any down if I cam across it but San Pedro is so easy and cheap to come by and since it's mescaline as well I can't imagine it's too different. Thanks for the info!

Great share. Curious how you extracted so quickly from the cacti though? Did you already have it prepared, because it looks like you have to boil it out for several hours or use an acid-base extraction?

Actually we just skinned them, sliced them lengthwise, cut out the woody core, and ate them like cucumber spears. I have a strong gut and am not bothered by extremely bitter things but most everyone else was pretty repulsed by the entire affaire. I prefer them that way, no matter what you do (the boiling, etc. . . ) you'll still end up with a bitter, kinda gross mess of stuff to eat. Might as well just pop it down.

For people working in high tech, LSD usage increased creativity the following day.

Citation?

In the current legal climate it's pretty much impossible to do any research on these issues, so we only have anecdotal reports for now. I'd personally like to see some responsible and sober research into the actual effects of psychedelics that have a well-established safety profile.

Anecdotal: http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2009/07/09/dr-lsd-to-steve-jobs-...

Anecdotal: http://www.maps.org/news-letters/v18n1/v18n1-MAPS_24.pdf

Anecdotal: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kary_Mullis#Use_of_LSD

Implicit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7F2X3rSSCU

I know people who took LSD innocently in the wrong environment and they're sectioned under mental health. Use with care.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Set_and_setting

Interestingly, I hear these stories all the time of "I heard of someone..." "know of someone..." "who took acid and is committed to a ward in a mental health facility." but have yet to ever have anyone verify this.

It makes the permanent "bad trip" seem almost myth (not saying you are part of this group, just brought this to mind)

More important to me; as I understand it the possibility of relapses at a much later date are not a myth. As such, I feel it's totally reasonable for law enforcement and similar jobs to immediately reject anyone with a history containing LSD (and I understand at least some do). So, if you want to work in law enforcement, you might want to avoid LSD.

(If you think LEO's should be allowed to have a history of LSD, let me ask you- assuming relapses happen- do you really want a guy with a gun and the authority to use it tripping on you? It may be million-to-one, but I sure don't)

While I believe your reasoning seems logical, it is flawed if you are singling out LSD or other "drugs". I'm not saying I do not agree with you.

But, alcohol abuse is estimated to be twice as prevalent in law enforcement (in the U.S. at least) than in the general population.

Alcohol Dementia is caused by long-term or excessive drinking (I don't believe it's long-term drinking, instead long-term unmoderated (excessive) drinking) that causes serious cognitive problems--in fact, 10% of all dementia patients reportedly have a history of prolonged alcohol abuse.

And if you know about dementia / alcohol dementia, that is just as scary a thought, and a much more imminent and likely danger compared to someone "relapsing" from prior LSD use.

Just food for thought.

And, mind you, a person can have a "flash-back" regardless of drug use if it was traumatic--e.g. post-war.

I wasn't singling out LSD. If dementia can cause similar effects, it makes just as much sense to prevent people with a history of any dementia, or something that will reliably cause dementia, from becoming LEO's.

I don't think this is true. There were a couple of academic studies showing that low doses of LSD (~25 mics) improved creativity during the session, but I don't think there have been any studies showing that a normal dose improved creativity the next day.

FYI The book What The Dormouse Said talks about the influence of LSD on the technology industry.

Studies have shown that ibogaine treatment reduces craving for opiates, stimulants (like cocaine or methamphetamine) and even alcohol after a single dose. What is especially intriguing to scientists is the fact that this effect can last a long time (anywhere from ten days to a few months), allowing the person to experience a state of mind they may not have anticipated experiencing again. Please visit http://www.ibogaine-treatment.com for more information.

On a related note, here's a mathematician comparing his experiences with DMT and LSD: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYDgmpiE-U0

There's also peyote use in the Native American Church.

I wonder if I could link LSD to the jerky movement of a very clever professor I know...

To paraphrase one of the people in the video LSD is like a catalyst: it depends on who you are and where you are.

Against all the benefits that these drugs offer they can also create mental illness. These drugs definitely need some control as they have just enough power to ruin as to enlighten. It would be good to advocate personal choice but widespread use can cause problems with society.

A friend of mine sees a flying stomach wherever he goes, thanks to LSD.

He dropped out of college, during his senior year. Sad.

Thanks to LSD? Perhaps to mental issues that already existed?

To represent LSD as risk free way to expand your mind just is not right. If you are going to take LSD be sure of your environment or who you are around. It isn't just whether you have certain mental state beforehand as you mental state is highly suggestive while tripping. Even recreational users in the 60's recognise that a bummer is possible. It can be worse than just having a bad trip. I've seen paranoia and other unwanted effects.

It's a double edged sword, so you are much better to control your environment as much as possible. Steering clear of negativity.

But I wasn't saying it was risk free, just that it isn't fair to blame LSD for "damaging the mind" when the mind may already be damaged.

they can also create mental illness.

I'm sorry but this is a a claim frequently made without context. Some evidence would be refreshing, along with some known causation, neurochemical or otherwise.

An anecdotal example, a friend of mine developed severe depression brought on by something inhibiting serotonin production/reception. Since LSD can vastly increase serotonin temporarily he suspected frequent LSD use could have something to do with it. This is one case out of hundreds of cases I know with no negative consequences. Going by my personal experience psychedelics are less dangerous than alcohol.

But personal experience is inadequate to explain the effects of these substances.

There have been hundreds of documented cases tryptamines causing psychosis and HPPD. If you want evidence just go to Erowid. Or read the book Darkness Shining Wild. Even at the MAPS conference last week there was a talk by a guy who developed severe psychosis after doing LSD. He thought he was the reincarnated Jesus and stayed awake for four days straight writing a new holy book, and then camped outside a bookstore for a couple months passing out copies to everyone who walked by. And then when he finally realized what he was doing a couple months later he tried to kill himself. The talk should be online in 6 weeks or so.

edit: Check out this YouTube video about a guy developing psychosis--

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7HBCSF9nfs&playnext_from...

Also, listen to Ben Fold's song Not The Same, about his friend who did LSD at a party and was never the same again: http://www.google.com/url?q=http://popup.lala.com/popup/5046...

The video itself outlines that for research LSD needs to be treated like a drug:

Karl Janson... warns of the dangers of unsupervised use

I think one important lesson is psychodelics are by-and-large catalysts. What happens very much depends on who uses it, under what circumstances and for what purpose.

I'm not against the taking of LSD, I've taken it myself. I am against it being treated like candy, with no respect. It certainly cannot be substituted for alcohol.

I would not want anyone reading to just go out and take it. Have a clear plan and a good support network around them: or don't take it.

You can't prove something doesn't make you mad by looking at brain chemistry.

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