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MIT Values

mitvalues.org

37 points_pius24 comments

This is fine but I think people should put more emphasis on acting on these values instead of declaring them. People will notice things quickly, there is no need to tell them all the time.

It reminds me of companies sending e-mails about innovation and agility while often acting exactly the opposite way. Just do it and people will notice soon.

While its hard to accuse MIT of being unscientific, actions do speak louder than words.

what did you have in mind? i agree?

Now all they have to do is label a dissenting opinion as one of those forms of discrimination or hate speech, and it's an instant win!

Their legitimacy and power as a group is based on their reputation for intellectual honesty. If they label a dissenting opinion as discrimination or hate speech, they would need to pair it with a reasonable argument otherwise their reputation would decrease. This is a good thing. This is how groups should engage in politics.

Exactly. It would be helpful if that document went into detail about what can be classified as discrimination, hate speech, etc. so as to make those terms less malleable and abusable. I also wish that it emphasized the intent of someone's speech and actions rather than the content or other's reactions to speech.

To the people who are complaining about this sort of thing: where do you draw the line on free speech on college campuses? For instance would you want universities to allow students to use racial slurs, with malice, in classroom discussions or paper, without any disciplinary consequences?

The burden of the proof is on the people asking for a line to be drawn to prove that drawing a line is necessary, at all. Until I see proof that students using racial slurs with malice causes significant harm, and this specifically because of the racial slurs, I do want universities to allow it.

The 'science isn't optional' part is a nice addition to the usual fare, but this is ultimately still the usual fare. And I think what bothers me about this stuff is that it sets such a low bar for human society. We reject hate. That should go without saying.

If you are going to say it, there's a lot more you should say too: What precisely "hate" is, how to identify it, how big of a problem you think it is, and how it should be handled when it's found. Not saying these things implies that hate is a much bigger problem than it actually is.[1]

What we really have here is quasi-religious rhetoric. Evil, hate, demons, and so forth. Who doesn't believe? Simply omit your name below so we all know who you are.

[1] Some (still quite limited) discussion on this point: http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/11/16/you-are-still-crying-wo...

Eventually activists are going to run out of categories in desperate and urgent need of stalwart defense. At some point it becomes simply a laundry list of fashionable trends in sociology.

Is it too much to ask that universities allow a free market of ideas, without drawing subjective lines categorizing them as "good" and "bad"?

yup.

with the emphasis on them being glorified, overpriced day-care centers, it seems that they're keen on teaching morality instead of presenting options to the supposed thinking adults on their campus.

good job!

some universities perhaps, but certainly not MIT.

and yes, morality is important to pass down from elders to youth.

it's not a university's job to teach me morality. I'm an adult. and I'd hope that those who attend are also adults.

education is not about imposing your personal values on somebody else, and that covers morality.

edit: I like how this is being downvoted. congratulations.

If you were actually an adult you would see the value in learning from other people's values.

You can adopt them or rally against them, that part is up to you. But being an adult means hearing out other people and understanding their values and why they are important to the community you are interacting with.

learning from other people's values, yes.

but a university is not a place to push morality. it's a place of education and ideas, and as a university, you can't stand by some values and curse others, because you're a campus of free thought and exchange.

the moment that you express some preference towards some ideas and start labeling others as bad or horrible, you push your own morality.

stop making it seem like I'm arguing for anything more than that.

what are you talking about? do you actually have a problem with faculty from one of the most renown universities advocating for equal and discrimination free education?

This. I feel a university should be a place of the truth and what cannot be classified as such is up for a debate.

That document classified nothing as true or untrue; it simply stated some things that are not compatible with the university's mission (goals being inherently subjective) and that the professors would resist such things. I would prefer that the document acknowledge that racism, bigotry, etc. are subjective judgments, however; it spoke of them as if they were objective classifications.

> Is it too much to ask that universities allow a free market of ideas, without drawing subjective lines categorizing them as "good" and "bad"?

I love relativists.

I love dogmatists.

What is the background for this? What is the call to action? This website doesn't seem to say much of anything at all...

agreed. what exactly is the message here?

the message is, "go to these people if you need help."

did you read it?

This is stupid college drama, an online petition so lazy it doesn't even bother to link to announcements it is complaining about.

Seriously, what the fuck HN? This wouldn't have been tolerated even a couple of years ago.

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