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Comment by jc4p | Hacker News Reader

Just FYI in case anyone is considering buying a Pixel: I strongly urge you not to. http://kasrarahjerdi.com/2016/11/dont-buy-anything-made-by-g...

They have no Google provided support, if you drop the phone and break it your only option (if you didn't buy the third-party warranty upsell) is to take it to a repair shop. I called the ones near me, none had seen or touched the device before.

Don't spend $800 on a phone that you can't send back to the manufacturer to repair.

Edit: I originally said "they have no warranty" and people seem to have understood that as "they don't provide free repairs" -- what I'm trying to say is that this phone is supposedly a competitor to Apple, but if you break it you can't walk to the Apple Store and ask them how much it'd be for a repair. You can't send it in the mail to them either. You have to go to an authorized third-party repair shop. That does not sound like first-class flagship $800 product support to me.

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It's funny, I'm this exact same boat. My pixel died a little after two week (which is the requirement to get a return). I filled out their warranty claim thing, and >48 hours finally got a response, which is a trouble shooting guide. I replied that I tried all that stuff, and had to wait another 2 days for another response (asking for information I already gave).

I'm extremely disappointed. I thought with their whole advertising of "24 hour support" they identified customer support as a weakness of theirs, and are trying to remedy it. Nope.

BTW in your case, you can probably just buy a new screen: http://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/google-ubreakifix-pixel/

If you bought it with a credit card, you might want to contact your card's customer service number. Most credit cards offer protection from this type of manufacturer "weaknesses".

Australia has really good consumer protection laws which protect against exactly this kind of problem.

https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees...

Except the Google store does not sell the phone in Australia. It pretends to, but it sells it to you from Singapore in Australian dollars. You have no rights in regards to the Australian law in the case. If you buy the phone at an Australian store you have access to the strong Australian rights (and you pay their retail price). I bought mine on the day from the google store and paid 3℅ more than the local price as well as getting it a week after it was available in stores. Quite a bad experience and I would not recommend friends to deal with google directly.

I was thinking about it, my credit card has always been extremely good about stuff like this. However, I use google for everything, my entire life is on it. I'd rather lose the $649 I paid for the pixel, then get blackballed from google services.

So for now, I'm just patiently awaiting their response and hopefully they'll give me the green light to mail it in for a replacement or something.

I think that the parent is saying that your credit-card company might be the 3rd party insurance, and you might be able to make a claim to take advantage of that insurance.

To add - many "good" credit cards provide "return protection" which allows you to make a claim against the card to get a refund within the first 30 days if the original vendor won't accept a return, and warranty extension which extends the original manufacturer's warranty a year. I have used both benefits quite a bit, and have always had a great experience.

FWIW, many also extend (sometimes up to double) the manufacturer's warranty on products you buy with the cards.

> It's funny, I'm this exact same boat. My pixel died a little after two week (which is the requirement to get a return). I filled out their warranty claim thing, and >48 hours finally got a response, which is a trouble shooting guide. I replied that I tried all that stuff, and had to wait another 2 days for another response (asking for information I already gave).

Are you not in the US? Maybe it's different elsewhere, but my nexus 5x died a little while ago, and I only had the default warranty, not the extra protection, and it was insanely easy to get a replacement.

I filled out the form[1] (saying I had already tried the usual android-saving moves), got a call back in two minutes as promised by that form, the customer service person accepted I had already tried things and didn't ask me to do anything else, then I immediately got the email with the link to get a new phone shipped to me. Was probably less than 15 minutes of my time.

(you also seem to be talking about something else than the OP. If your phone died in two weeks that's definitely under the warranty, regardless of if you purchased extra protection).

[1] linked here: https://support.google.com/store/answer/6301527?hl=en

I had a similar deal with a Nexus 4 where the Bluetooth died. I jumped through the Factory Reset hoop and they agreed to send me a new one. I even said "there's big gash on the screen" and the response was "if the screen is full functional then it's ok."

I'm glad to hear that they're good about it. At the end of the day, as long as I get a positive outcome I will be happy. I guess it's likely that due to the launch their support systems are totally overwhelmed at the moment.

FWIW before it stopped working, the pixel was hands done the best phone I've ever used, in almost every category.

My experience with Google Play Store returns is similar. I have bought a Nexus 5 for a friend and returned it three times because of various issues. Every time they have shipped the replacement phone immediately after I have submitted the claim.

I was not asked to do any troubleshooting.

I had the same experience with my older Nexus 5. However, I dropped my Nexus 6P and cracked the screen (And did not take the insurance). They now tell me there is nothing they can do and that I can try my luck with Huawei.

> I thought with their whole advertising of "24 hour support" they identified customer support as a weakness of theirs, and are trying to remedy it. Nope.

I'm very sorry you had that awful experience. I know it doesn't remedy your past experience, but please know myself and many other Googlers have been and still are putting a lot of work into the tools being used by the customer support reps around the globe to better help you.

In the meantime, are there any other solutions that you and the Google #squad plan to offer? Like...people who will answer a phone call?

I appreciate what you're trying to do, but unfortunately this is kind of the problem with the Google culture. Everything has to be done with automation and better tools because they simply do not have the ability to go through the massive amounts of customers that they have without them. Unfortunately, at some point you need a human on the other end that can make a decision, especially with refund/warranty cases.

Sorry that my first post wasn't emphatic enough. The tools the team I'm a part of builds are used by real people (including other Googlers) fielding real telephone calls helping real customers through warranty and refund cases. None of it is automated for use without a human in the loop.

Everyone on the team I'm a part of recognizes the perception you've eloquently provided, and very much care to scale with humans in the loop.

Out of interest, this "in the loop" terminology sounds odd to me and sounds like business speak. Is this common in Google?

I remember once contacting Sun for info on software many years ago and received an email where they promised that someone would "reach out to me".

I didn't want to be reached out for - I just wanted some text answering my question.

Nope, "in the loop" is just me mangling a slang phrase I personally use -- "Keep me in the loop" -- which means "keep me informed in a real time manner". It's not the first odd phrase I've put together, as my girlfriend likes to remind me: "I don't words well".

Haha ok, so not the corporate business speak. I must say that your girlfriend's expression is somewhat "unique" too :-)

I don't know of any phone vendor that offers a warranty against accidental damage (that doesn't cost extra).

By the way: "Google and uBreakiFix offer walk-in repairs for Pixel and Pixel XL" http://www.androidauthority.com/google-ubreakifix-repairs-pi...

I called the uBreakiFix in Denver: "we've never seen that phone before, but yeah I think I could fix it".

I'm not upset that they don't have an accidental damage warranty, I'm upset that I can't send it to them and pay them the $100/$200/$300 or whatever it is directly for _them_ to fix it, not some random dude who's never seen the Pixel before.

Google will never do anything that involves hiring O(N) employees to support N customers. They'll always outsource things like support, repairs, etc. so that someone else can handle scaling people, while they just go on scaling machines. Given that, the only real possibility is that "some random dude" is going to end up fixing your Pixel.

On the other hand, the "who's never seen the Pixel before" part? C'mon, the phone just came out—if an i-device breaks on the first day, you'd better believe that if you take it to an Apple Store someone's fixing it who has never seen that device before. That's the fundamental problem of new hardware designs (especially when coupled to bathtub curves); you can't blame Google for it. Give them a month and every repair shop around you will have fixed plenty of Pixels.

If an i-device breaks on the first day and you take it to an Apple Store, the tech fixing it has:

* A repair manual

* Parts

* Tools

* The ability to replace your device on-the-spot with a new one if they brick it

When has an Apple Store had spares of their hot new phone available on the first day? A month out, sure, but come on.

Got my iphone 7p on the 1st week, noticed some small debris in the lens, went to my local Apple Store, they had the same device ready in stock as a replacement, in&out took 10 mins. (note my device is probably one of the most wanted one, Unlocked-128 black)

I broke my 6s+ the 2nd day after release and got it replaced the same day. They have separate replacement stock even at launch.

When the first iPads came out, I actually received mine by post a day or two before the official launch day. It worked for a few hours, then the screen wouldn't switch on. At that point, iPads were super rare. Rarer than any iPhones have been since then.

I went to my local Apple store on release day, showed them it wasn't working, and they swapped it out straight away, no questions asked.

So oursource it.

Send your pixel to our authorized repair shop here. They will bill you.

ZTE's Axon 7 comes with their Passport 2.0 warranty which covers accidental damage with a $80 deeucitble, I believe. It's not a full coverage of accidental damage due to the deductible, but it's still much better than its competitors (in many other aspects as well).

If I may say so, a family member has one, and the phone itself is excellent. Much better speakers and included accessories compared to the Pixel line at around half the price.

Have you ever tried to get something Apple branded repaired when it is out of warranty?

The repairs tend to basically cost as much as it would to buy the same item refurbished regardless of the issue.

SSD died on your MacBook air selling for $500 on eBay? That will be a $450 repair sir.

Sure, they may have manuals and everything else at the Apple store, but there is very clearly a reason why companies like iCracked and iFixIt exist, and it isn't because Apple offers such a wonderful and affordable repair shop.

It would be great if Google offered a way to get the phone repaired through them, but using Apple as an example of how it should be is a bit insane to me.

Yes.

4+ year old iMac with dead video card. I took it to the local authorized Apple dealer, who wanted $50 to diagnose the problem.

Dealer called back and said Apple agreed to replace the video card for free and cover the $50 dealer diagnosis fee.

That sounds like a recall.

I had the same thing on an older MacBook Pro with dodgy graphics card. Took it in to an authorised dealer, who didn't charge me up front for diagnosis, to then get a call saying it had been replaced and no fee was due as covered by Apple under a previous recall. This was in the US.

This is just nonsense. In some cases the repair may cost the same as refurbished item but definitely not always. And remember that refurbished item is not new so it's not guarenteed to last for ever either. Cracked screen repairs for example aren't the same price as a new iPhone.

At least with Apple I can drive to a physical store, hand my laptop or phone over and know it will be repaired properly. And in many cases I've been either (a) upgraded to newer hardware or (b) just had the device swapped entirely.

A few points:

1. Cracked screens are incredibly easy to fix, so the one example you can give that doesn't cost an arm and a leg is the one thing that arguably any random repair shop should be able to do.

2. Not everyone even lives near an apple store, so while you might benefit from driving in to a physical store, there is a large chunk of the population who won't (at least not without driving a few hours).

PA is a great example of this - the only stores in PA are basically around Philly and around Pittsburgh. Live anywhere else in the state and you are driving to a store out of town.

That isn't so bad if prices are reasonable, but when you get there and hear "$600 to replace the battery" the stores start to feel less useful.

I understand that there is value in the Apple store. I'm not trying to say that there isn't any, but I do believe the original comment overstates that value, especially when Google (or a third party they work with) offers a pretty reasonable replacement plan as an add-on to your purchase.

> 1. Cracked screens are incredibly easy to fix, so the one example you can give that doesn't cost an arm and a leg is the one thing that arguably any random repair shop should be able to do.

Provided you can find spare parts, good luck finding spare parts for the Pixel. For Apple products it's usually a breeze.

More like $200 to replace the battery in the case of a laptop (you said $600, a wild exaggeration). Or $100 if we're talking about a phone.

Or free if you paid $100 - $250 (depending on the class of device it covers) for AppleCare.

AppleCare is head and shoulders above other extended warranty plans in my experience. Others tend to be jokes or ripoffs or both.

Also little known fact: Mac repair hardware costs are price capped when repairs are done through an Apple Store. So replacing a keyboard and battery is close to the same price as replacing the screen, battery, logic board, keyboard, power board, etc... as they repair and replace basically up to every part of your laptop, the price stays capped (except for labor but that's low because they work fast). Most people don't know about this. Apple keeps it quiet for some reason.

In this case, if we're comparing to cracked screens, Apple charges $129/$149 on their iPhones.

I realize you are just providing info, and I appreciate it, so I want to preface this by saying I am also just trying to add some context to the conversation.

The pixel offers a $99 replacement plan, plus an additional $99 every time you replace the phone, up to 2 times. I think it lasts for 2 years.

If the only thing holding you back on getting the phone is being able to get it repaired, the cost difference is $70 or $50 the first time you break your screen, and $40 or $0 the second time, and the plan covers more than just broken screens.

The biggest downside is that you have to front the $99.

Right, it's very similar to most plans where you break even around ~2 screen replacements. Like you said, if you have to utilize the insurance for things aside from the 2 screen replacements, then you come out even further ahead.

But that requires foresight in buying the insurance and most people just don't have that. In my case, I have only ever broken one phone, so buying insurance with the idea that I break even at ~2 incidents would not be worth it for me. In the Pixel's case, I would like the option to pay full fees for fixing rather than only the option of previously having had foresight AND having to break my phone twice.

So this happened to me. My 2012 retina MacBook Pro battery was dying. Which makes sense, I used it every day for over four years.

I figured I could take it to Apple for a battery replacement. They said they would do it — for $900. They told me it involved replacing the entire bottom half of the computer as the battery was glued in.

So I called their support line and complained that the laptop was perfectly fine and it shouldn't cost that much to replace a battery. They ended up replacing it for free, as well as the screen (because they identified that the anti-reflective coating was starting to wear). So while the policy was ridiculous, the actual outcome was very positive.

> $900. They told me it involved replacing the entire bottom half of the computer as the battery was glued in.

WTF? This is nonsense.

Apple prices for battery repairs are clearly outlined on their web site[0]. This has always been what I (or relatives/friends/coworkers) paid for France[1] when I had to change a battery.

[0]: https://support.apple.com/mac-notebooks/repair/service/prici...

[1]: https://support.apple.com/fr-fr/mac-notebooks/repair/service...

That is the exact page I used to argue my case with Apple on the phone. I said it was misleading that the price given to me at the Apple store was so much higher than what was listed on their website.

They told me that those prices are the service pricing, but do not include parts. And because the entire lower-half of the laptop needed to be changed in the rMBP model, the total cost would come to about $900 AUD.

The actual item listed on the repair invoice is "Top Case Assembly with Battery" @ $562.73 and the "Hardware Repair Labor" charge is listed at $289 AUD.

Did you ever have friends or relatives change the battery in a retina MacBook Pro? Apple cannot remove the battery because it is glued into the lower case assembly. And so when I got my machine back from Apple the trackpad, keyboard, and lower aluminium chassis was brand new (however the bottom plate, logic board, and internals were the same).

I've heard of this happening before. If the non-battery bit of that part of the computer breaks you pay $900 (or whatever), but if you just need the battery replacing you pay a heck of a lot less, or even nothing. The repair involves exactly the same actual work being done and part. The Apple Store employee must have accidentally selected the wrong maintenance option in the system.

The Apple employee at the store explained that they cannot remove the battery from the rMBP model as it is glued in place.

When I complained in-person and through phone support I was told the same story specifically about the retina MBP model. They said that the standard charge for battery replacement in this model included the entire lower case assembly. I heard this from about four different support agents, even when it was escalated to the special support agent that was able to eventually authorise the free repair.

When I received my MacBook Pro back from battery service the keyboard, trackpad, and lower aluminium chassis were brand new. So they did change it all out just to replace the battery.

I recently took my Macbook to get a new battery at the Apple Store. While I was there, I asked for them to fix the lid as it was a little loose and was bugging me.

Not only did they not do it (they initially said no problem), they lied and told me I needed to replace the entire panel for $800 as it was a broken `spring` and could not be fixed.

I called bullshit and fixed it myself at home with a screw driver set.

$800 to tighten a screw?!

This is so dead wrong.

Definitely!

I was burned by this and Motorola before as well here in the UK. The official repairers are just about as awful as you can get. Half the screen stopped working after a month. The official repairer cocked up the handset further and claimed water damage and sent me an invoice for £138 (handset price was £159 new) holding the handset to ransom. This was when Google/Motorola were the same company in theory.

A letter was sent back suggesting that they can insert the invoice in a body orifice of their choice and send it back now or it'd be small claims court. It arrived 5 days later by courier. Proximity sensor was dicky, so it went back again. That took a month.

Paying for an Apple product is almost worth it for the service. I prefer to go without either though.

Is that a common thing? Being able to send your device back to the manufacturer for user inflicted issues for repair?

I can't say I've ever done that with any product ever...

In the article, the author says that other companies (Samsung, Apple) do support that, but for a fee. It seems reasonable to expect Google to also provide that service.

I guess Apple is one example I've used before, so I take back my previous statement there.

Still, I feel like that's a silly reason to advise people never buy the phone. Especially when they do provide an "insurance" policy with a "blessed 3rd party".

It's quite common. HTC even advertise it as something you can do for free: http://www.htc.com/us/uh-oh-protection/

They also advertise it as "hassel"-free, which is funny.

Nut allergies can be serious business.

Only if you buy that one phone from them on their website.

You could not get that phone second hand (or from any other reseller) and send it in to them for repair.

That's basically "insurance" included in the price of the phone, not a "pay for what you broke" repair center.

They've had that program for prior phones of theirs, that were not directly bought through them.

Source: I first heard about this program from my reseller-purchased HTC One m8.

What phones have warranty against dropping included?

>I can’t send my $800 phone to the manufacturer and pay some extra money to get it repaired like I could if this was a Samsung or Apple device.

It's not warranty or free repairs he is asking for isn't it? He is asking for paid support.

Ah, I didn't read article. But google also provides some options for that: https://store.google.com/magazine/device_protection https://support.google.com/fi/answer/6309809?hl=en

You can turn off the cast notification[1]. I'm pretty sure they started doing that because you could start casting things from the Home, so they wanted a way for the user to control that from the phone after it started.

[1] https://support.google.com/chromecast/answer/7206638?hl=en

Sounds similar to the level of support I've gotten out of Samsung. My primary consideration on phones is now: either cheap enough to chuck in the trash and buy a new one, or completely user repairable. So far I've been using $30~50 android phones off of Amazon, but I'm looking forward to the Fairphone.

Thats why I use case

Wait - What kind of phone manufacturer offers accident coverage right out of the box?

Read the article. He's not saying he wants accident coverage, he's saying he should be able to pay a fee and get it fixed like all other manufacturers allow.

>I can’t send my $800 phone to the manufacturer and pay some extra money to get it repaired like I could if this was a Samsung or Apple device.

>Hey Google, if you want to pivot into a real brand: You need to provide real support. No other flagship phone tells people “well, good luck” if they have a common incident break the device.

Not a phone, but Amazon offer an included 'no worries' warranty on their Kindle Fire Kids edition tablet - in the UK at least.

I have two reasonably destructive young children, so it's a little extra piece of mind.

The author needs to take responsibility for own actions. The phone stopped working correctly after the author damaged it.

heh, it's my phone, i broke it, I'm out a chunk of money. I am fully aware of that. I'm upset that I can't pay a small increment of money to a trusted source to remedy that. I have never felt the need to have a case on a phone before (I am a mobile developer and have dozens of phones) because all my other ones have been able to survive falls of that intensity.

I'm sad that I'm out some money, and I definitely think I am at fault, but I don't think I'm being unreasonable.

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