A letter to today’s young people | Hacker News Reader

A letter to today’s young people

marco.org

21 pointsShank16 comments

Not the best message to young people: that puts people on either "the good, progressive side" or the "bad, conservative side". This is what creates the divisive, no-compromise society we see today. In addition, for some folks, it will seem like someone is telling them how to think.

The world is often more mixed than you'd think. For example, it's not like Trump supporters all absolutely reject progressive ideals. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/trump-voters-climate-cha...

I'm in agreement vtange. This paragraph stuck out the most to me: "In the meantime, do everything you can to help, support, and stand up for the millions of people whose country just let them down, many of whom live in homes and communities that have just become unwelcoming or unsafe."

We live in a democracy - what about the millions of other people who feel like Trump will vocalize what they've been feeling for a long time? I'm not saying any one is right or wrong, but this article does seem to imply that there are millions of people who were just made victims by the outcome of the election. It does nothing to start a meaningful dialogue. I think it's important that we Help, Support, and Stand Up...but not because the country let anyone down. We should do that for everyone, everyday because they are Human Beings and they deserve it. Categorizing people into groups is exactly what landed this country in this polarizing situation. We need to start treating all people decently, not just the ones we're in agreement with. Kindness is the International Currency.

Americans need to stop dividing themselves into liberal and conservative. People are much more complex. This way of thinking is the best recipe for an eventual civil war and in the meantime it stops any reasonable political discourse.

Not really. Most of the population is near the middle and doesn't care how you label them. People on the fringes are loud. That's all you're hearing.

Some of the best, kindest, most giving people I know are conservative. They're your firefighters, your nurses, your doctors, your mechanics, your teachers... Many, many people that are deep and complex and everything they believe is not wrong. This author would do well to acquaint himself with the side he demonizes and get to know people outside his bubble and the lens of propaganda.

This piece is disturbingly ageist and naive in parts:

"That’s not because you’re inexperienced — it’s because you’re right. Your generation is, by definition, further ahead on the march of progress than everyone else. It is literally you who cause the progress as older people die and you rise into power."

The exact same thing was claimed by the young generations who grew into adulthood along with the rise of multiple fascist and communist regimes. Sometimes change is progress and sometimes it's not. Assuming that new beliefs are correct because they are new is dangerous and wrong.

If being liberal is right, why do a lot of people switch camps when they get older. You get less correct with age? Or maybe it's a little more complex than that?

I think in general people just want more stability as they get older, including protecting the wealth and status they've accumulated. Rightly or wrongly, this might encourage them to support the "conservative" side, which purports to want to protect the status quo and the way things were in "the good old days".

When dealing with the conservative, liberal divide I don't think right or wrong are the correct way to look at things. I myself have shifted from liberal to conservative. I don't think patting my self on the back saying I'm correct and congratulating everyone who agrees with me is productive. I want a better society for myself, my family and for everyone else. My view on the way to get there has changed, that doesn't make me better or worse than someone that wants to try a different way.

Agreed. I think "a better society for myself, my family and for everyone else" is what a lot of people want. (I would have said it's what most people want, except for the part about also wanting it "for everyone else".) Unfortunately, strategies for attempting to achieve a better society reside in an incredibly complex multi-dimensional space, but the media and the US political system force those strategies to be projected down onto a single dimension of liberal versus conservative, then discretized into two sides. The end result being that probably most people are unhappy with the way political discourse is carried out, but can't do anything productive about it. At least that's how I feel right now...

A lot of people I know feel that way too. We're all somebody's son or daughter. We may have sons or daughters of our own. I don't have kids, but I want to see a better world for my niece and nephews.It's really about the kids.

Things have been working Great for a lot of people in this country, but not for the average working person working 40 hours/week for $16k dollars/year.

It used to be we could expect our kids to have more opportunities than their parents, but that's no longer the case.

That's what we have to fix.

Sure. But while most of us are happy to work our asses off to improve our own status and our family's status, how many of us really put a significant amount of effort (time or money) into improving things for people who are worse off than we are? Especially when many of the people who need help seem to hold opinions that we find repugnant -- racism, sexism, LGBTQ hate, etc.

One thing this election has made clear to me is that we can't rely on the government to safeguard our society. The Republicans, of course, want to actively dismantle the government, while the Democrats (at least as represented by Clinton) will put in the minimum effort required to give the appearance of adequate progress to their base, while still effectively pursuing the same primary goal as the Republicans: further enrichment of the 1%. In other words, I don't see another New Deal or even a Great Society happening any time soon, unless there is a huge swing of the pendulum back in the other direction in 2018 and 2020.

I've been trying carefully not to turn this into a partisan rant. What I've really been wondering to myself the last few days is whether and how it's possible to effect positive change in society in a way that is scalable and routes around the brokenness of politics. (And preferably doesn't require me to quit my job and work for some broke-ass non-profit...)

Racism, sexism and homophobia are not issues the government need have a monopoly on. More good is done when attitudes are changed and hearts are won. I'm not sure the current approach of vilifying opponents will work. But most people have more compassion than they're given credit for. Engaging with people challenging false ideas and encouraging good ones can improve things. But in order for that to happen people from the differing views need to have contact and meaningful dialogue. I fear society is stratifying. Telling people they need to love people of other races, genders, sexual orientation and faiths while calling them nasty bigots sends mixed messages.

This piece isn't great. Sure, I agree that the election outcome was bad. In fact, I think it was an utter disaster. This piece tells young people (presumably, "millenials") not to worry, it'll be okay in the end. But it's too easily interpreted as "don't take action, it all works out in the end anyway".

A TON of millenials didn't vote in this election, and that's why the values they cherish (or will soon realize they cherish) will be trampled over. Marco's message isn't a call to action; instead it's placating. I hope someday we can look back and say "well, that was just a wrong turn." But goshdarnit, 3 days after the election is too early for that!

PS -- Like other commenters, I agree that this piece is a little too simplistic in its view of young=liberal=good and old=conservative=bad. I don't agree with that, and besides, it's a little tasteless to imply "don't worry, those people that disagree with you will die soon enough."

> Obama didn’t (and couldn’t) fix everything Bush broke. But we did fix most of it, and made a lot of progress in major new areas as well. Overall, we came out way ahead.

The Drone and Stuxnet programs are far from a step forward. Every president seems to bring us to a worse state then before. It's not a political line that needs to be drawn but instead one of corruption.

"we suffered through that horrific administration"

Thousands of Americans died and hundreds of thousands of Iraqi's and Afgani's died. You obviously weren't one of them. Your weren't part of that. You went to college and lived your life in peace, but somehow you suffered as much as the people who watched their families die and their countries fall apart because your "conscience hurt".

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