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Comment by Yetanfou | Hacker News Reader

    ...iPhone 7 being the first example.

No, iPhone 7 is certainly not the first example of a multi-camera phone. There have been several multi-sensor phones, this year both Huawei (P9) and LG (G5) were launched with such. In an article on these devices it is noted that 'Apple's iPhone 7 Plus is rumored to be following their lead later this year'. Correct, Apple did follow their lead, especially Huawei's as the P9 does just what is described in the article: it uses multiple sensors to increase image quality.

http://www.theverge.com/2016/4/11/11406098/lg-g5-huawei-p9-t...

Please don't perpetuate this myth of Apple being first with such and so. As a rule they are not first with anything, instead they see what others are doing and produce their own version of the idea. A refined version often, but that does not make it the first version.

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There were actually a couple of cameras before the P9 and G5 using dual lenses (and I assume sensors) for doing weird 3D/DOF field stuff: http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/138719-dual-lens-smartphone-...

Your (and the most important) point about the iPhone 7 not being the first is bang on.

The first with a good enough implementation and actually used by a significant number of people.

See GUI, multimedia, multitouch, etc

Have you tried the others or are you just assuming that Apple's implementation is better?

In the cited cases, not only tried, but actively used them. If you mean multicamera phone, no, never used one. Not from Apple or any manufacturer.

I think it's wise to consider that there might be more to "Apple did it first" than hype, specially since it's such a common praise/criticism: Apple II, Mac, iPod, iPhone.

Do other phones show real time preview? Do they look as good? Although far from perfect, are the photos good enough that you might want to share/keep it more often than not?

There certainly is more to 'Apple did it first' than hype. Those who claim Apple did it first often do so out of ignorance rather than hype. They simply assume that Apple is the leading innovator which is copied by others.

On you questions about other phones showing live preview or looking 'as good' (something which surely is subjective?) I can only advice you to look at test reports for mobile devices in the last few years. In most cases Samsung seems to top the list, both in the photo quality department as well as the (subjective) 'looks' category. A quick search for 'best camera phone' for the last two years and a tally of the results shows the Samsung Galaxy S7 (Edge or normal) to win in 2016, the Samsung Galaxy S6 and LG G4 in 2015. Apple does compete in this market and ends up performing above average but others do better.

So, to return to your statement about is being 'wise to consider that there might be more to "Apple did it first" than hype, specially since it's such a common praise/criticism'; yes, there is more to it, but it is not founded on the fact that Apple always make superior products. They make products of above average quality and sell them at an above average price to a captive audience which is convinced of the superiority of their choice above others. That conviction is not based on direct comparison with other products, it merely stems from their conviction of Apple being 'first' and 'best'. The captive audience is kept that way by the closed nature of Apple's product lines - hardware and software alike - which often makes it more expensive to 'switch sides' than to plunk down for the next iteration of iSomething or Macsomething

I was referring to the fake bokeh mode.

Not the first to market, but first with a decent user experience.

I'm as "androidist" as you can get (owned an iDevice once, got it for free and sold it off still wrap-sealed), but even I flat out assume that when e.g. HTC does dual camera, it's a pointless act of attention grabbing (and indeed, the M9 returned to a conventional camera), whereas I am quite confident that Apple would not do it without some actual value delivered.

Huawei had sold 6M of the P9 in September. Apple sold 13M combining both models the first week last year, and they have not released sales this year, but it's supposedly down around 25%.

I'm not even sure what you mean with multimedia and multitouch. Are you suggesting other phones don't have it? Does iPhone have better "multimedia"?

With the absence of some industry standard multimedia port, I don't think some has any lead in that area.

I was citing examples of first "usable", rather than absolute first.

Multitouch, Apple wasn't first, but it was the first device most people owned that featured such screen with a thoughtful UX.

Same with other examples

What does it say about the implementations prior to Apple's that everyone always thinks Apple's is the first?

This will invariably insight flame, but you did ask:

That Apple consumers aren't very informed consumers? I'm not knocking their products, but I know plenty of mainly Apple users that buy them because they are solid, middle-of-the-road products that don't require much thought. That's both good and bad.

Disclaimer: I have had iPhones, iPads and might buy a Macbook after todays reveal depending on featureset.

It's not Apple consumers, so much as the general public. I guarantee you that the average Android smartphone owner (if they even knew that dual cameras exist) thought Apple was the first to do so too. It's marketing. Positively for Apple, and negatively for the brands who have this tech and don't manage to get the word to the average person.

You make a big mistake in assuming owners of Android phones are more informed than Apple owners. Especially since Android owners outnumber Apple by quite a margin. You may be correct in assuming that the more informed consumer tends to purchase an Android device (though maybe not), but that doesn't lead to your conclusion.

You are right, it was a bit of a lizard response. I really don't judge people for either decision of hardware, but more by their justification of that choice. There are numerous reasons for going for either brand/model. But I do notice a lot of these threads tend to express the same (incorrect assumption) as GP, which kind of riles me up.

It could be anything from better implementation to brand awareness and perception to marketing.

It is a big jump to just assume Apple's solution's popularity implies Apple has the better solution.

Edit: LG's wide-angle solution pleased a lot of people (just enthusiasts? idk) because of the utility in taking shots of landscapes.

Apple's solution is also great for those moments you want to zoom in just a bit more without destroying quality completely.

Huawei's solution is excellent for capturing more detail with black/white though their software processing isn't great.

Personally I wouldn't mind a solution with 4 cameras: Cam 1 for regular shots. Zoom in and the Apple-style camera is used. Zoom out and the LG-Style is used. The black/white camera will be used where it makes sense to enhance the image or when you select a b/w filter.

"Everyone" probably thinks Teslas are the first electric cars, yet electric cars existed in the late 1800s.

They are often the first to remove things.

#courage

"Please don't perpetuate this myth of Apple being first with such and so. As a rule they are not first with anything, instead they see what others are doing and produce their own version of the idea. A refined version often, but that does not make it the first version."

I really don't understand why people are getting so worked up of company X of Y being first or debunking Apple myths....

I personally couldn't care less (and I think most consumers) because I value a good working implementation before the fact that a brand is the first in anything. Why does that matter?

Because we mostly don't have favorite sports teams?

   I really don't understand why people are getting so worked up of company X of Y being first or debunking Apple myths....

This is 'hacker news' which implies that a sizeable percentage of visitors are 'hackers', a species known for its appreciation of fact over fiction. Let the first be the first, and stay that way, even if a while later someone else comes along and does it again but this time with racing stripes and spoilers.

Here there be logic, cold hard facts and objectivity. Save the subjectivity and waffling for Emacs <-> Vi and the like.

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