Europe and Russia prepare for historic landing on Mars
nature.com
nature.com
First I was excited to become aware of a new human artifact landing on Mars today - but now I'm even more fascinated by how things could've turned out if the Russians had managed to boogie around in an rc car on Mars three decades ahead of NASA...
Do you mean that in a threat to the world way or in a yay for science way?
The data was not encrypted. It was often the case that the west had access to the data before the Soviets, due to a better network of radio telescopes.
"The carrier signal from Schiaparelli was received by an Indian radio telescope array up until a point late in the the probe's descent sequence, apparently some time after it deployed its parachute.
"We were tracking the signal traced to near the arrivial on the surface of Mars," the mission director said. "We expected it to continue, but clearly it did not. I think we have to recognize this was an experimental setup."
Engineers were not sure the direct radio link from Schiaparelli to Earth would be stable, so ESA's Mars Express and Trace Gas Orbiter spacecraft were recording the carrier signal and detailed telemetry, respectively.
ESA says it will take about 90 minutes for that information to be relayed to Earth and analyzed.
"Let's not jump to conclusions," the mission director said. "We need to look at it, and we need to wait for the next step to get additional data from one of the relay stations... Let's wait for the next step to look at the more complete dataset."
> ESA chief Woerner now spinning possible landing failure in a way to ensure that $330M is available from ESA govts for ExoMars 2020 in Dec.
https://twitter.com/pbdes/status/788811531404337152
would be unfortunate and sad if this failure would mean cancellation of the real mission :(
For the love of all that's holy... ESA needs to learn a thing or two from NASA about public relations.
And then choose whether or not to practise these teachings based on space/weight constraints and the type of mission (scientific, in this case).
I'm sure they did think about it for a minute, but I have the feeling that the European public opinion doesn't have a "picture or it didn't happen" attitude.
When I can show a pic to my nephews and say "look, this is from another planet!" their eyes shine. And some of those excited kids could one day do science themselves, and advance our knowledge. I think it's an investment one should consider making, beyond the mere going there and collect rocks (which, of course, is the essential part).
If no sponsor saw scientific benefit in a camera then no camera goes . They also own the data from their instruments, so ESA is restricted in what material it can release during a mission.
This is true. Regrettably. The instruments are often built using public money and the platforms they sit on are almost always launched using public money, but the affiliated universities get to restrict everyone else's access to the data for years.
I personally know people working at ESA who were denied the right to publish their work and whose conference talks (in the area of interplanetary navigation) were censored by their managers because it was feared that they would reveal too much information which could conceivably be used by scientists from unaffiliated institutions in their research.
Open access is not big in ESA at all. This is a complete opposite of NASA's commitment to keep all data acquired with public money open to the public.
It's more that these things are funded up the EU chain, people deciding it don't even need to get elected (and EU representatives get elected on a different issues) so they probably don't give a shit what the public thinks about them spending their money.
http://www.esa.int/About_Us/Welcome_to_ESA/ESA_and_the_EU
NB I don't know if funding decisions are made on a project by project basis.
Edit: Also for the European Commissioners are appointed by the elected governments of member states.
ESA funding is NEVER on the table as a topic of discussion in any kind of public elections of such officials in the EU.
"as a waste of money merely 'to put a Frenchman into space.'"
Who campaign and are elected on issues totally unrelated to things like this. Basically the public probably doesn't even know it's paying for this until it's reported in the news. At least stuff like this gets debated in the US.
For example if I walked around in my office among 20 people (with higher education and into tech) and ask them what ESA is I doubt 5 would know what it stands for and even less that they are paying for it. Everyone knows what NASA is.
Should politicians refuse to do anything that was not in their campaign leaflets?
> For example if I walked around in my office among 20 ...
Try it out.
In my opinion, this is a very unlikely hypothetical. I'm from a country that is not a member of the ESA - never met a person yet that doesn't know what it is, or stands for.
Rosetta in particular caused a lot of excitement, it was on the news a lot, people were following ESA and the lander's accounts on Twitter etc.
No - my point is there is no pressure to improve PR because it's not a voting issue for the people deciding it's funding in EU.
>In my opinion, this is a very unlikely hypothetical.
Just asked 4 next to my desk - only one knew what "ESA" stands for, expected since he's in to that kind of thing - don't feel like disturbing more people :)
It would be great, yes.
They could also ask the public anew when such a thing emerges...
>In my opinion, this is a very unlikely hypothetical. I'm from a country that is not a member of the ESA - never met a person yet that doesn't know what it is, or stands for.
For real? Where did you ask, inside the ESA headquarters?
The average EU citizen has absolutely no idea what ESA is or does.
Source? a good percentage of the people I know from Europe does.
>Should politicians refuse to do anything that was not in their campaign leaflets? It would be great, yes.
They should refuse to do anything that was against (or far from what was in) their program. Leaflets hardly reflect all of a candidate's program.
Well, I don't just know people from Europe, I am from Europe.
Computer programmers and geeky types are not representative of the general population.
>They should refuse to do anything that was against (or far from what was in) their program. Leaflets hardly reflect all of a candidate's program.
Maybe they should though? Why allow for non approved/requested by the public policy changes that they come up on their own?
Even better, ask in a direct democratic way for anything not in the program (yeah, within reason -- they could do trivial things and directing).
Maybe if the two of you had actually looked for a source rather than argued you'd have found that yourself..
https://ec.europa.eu/growth/sectors/space_en (Scroll down to documents - the two eurobarometers)
Me too. My "Source?" question is still standing.
Computer programmers and geeky types are not representative of the general population.
That's not the people I referred to when talking of who knows about ESA.
>They should refuse to do anything that was against (or far from what was in) their program. Leaflets hardly reflect all of a candidate's program. Maybe they should though? Why allow for non approved/requested by the public policy changes that they come up on their own?
Leaflets are small pieces of information that are supposed to be simple and direct. Do you expect details on NASA funding in an A5 piece of papers that barely contains a face and a slogan (and perhaps a few phone numbers and a Twitter handle)?
Even better, ask in a direct democratic way for anything not in the program (yeah, within reason -- they could do trivial things and directing).
Ask any political scientist why this is not a good idea.
What source exactly do you ask for? Some official poll giving the relative recognizability of European organizations and agencies?
Your source was having talked to some people from Europe. My experience is the direct opposite, by the facts that:
Having talked with lots of people about ESA (as an enthusiast/geek person) and having been met with blank stares.
The fact that it features less on European news than NASA.
The fact that it doesn't have any celebrated triumphs, NASA-style.
The fact that it never or almost never comes up in political discussions about the EU.
Try asking some people from all walks of life, average person of the street style...
Yes. That would give a more accurate figure than my or your limited people network.
Your source was having talked to some people from Europe. My experience is the direct opposite, by the facts that:...
Your people network and my network, again, are not representative and should not be taken as fact but is just anecdotal. The other three facts only show that ESA is less known than NASA to the average European. Your claim was stronger, and I quote you: "The average EU citizen has absolutely no idea what ESA is or does."
[edited for completeness]
And I stand by that. Unfortunately I don't have something like the Mechanical Turk for Europe to do a poll.
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Space_Agency#Member_s...
Given that the US is a federation and the EU is a union, I would not expect European elections (which are parliamentary) to mention that, as each country selects its MPs for representation in the EU parliament.
Besides, I didn't hear NASA mentioned in the Clinton/Trump debate so far, though I didn't follow it closely.
[1] http://exploration.esa.int/mars/45103-rover-instruments/
https://chemtrailsplanet.net/2015/12/19/another-nasa-hoax-ma...
15:03UT: Accordingly to nominal timeline, Schiaparelli be shutting down its radio after landing to conserve power. Stay tuned #ExoMars
https://twitter.com/ESA_EDM/status/788757413931413508
It's unclear to me whether they expected to hear a confirmation signal after landing before entering this power-saving mode.
EDIT: Not good.
End of planned @ESA_EDM transmission - still no signal at #GMRT - this is not unexpected due to very faint signal at #GMRT #ExoMars
He made a surface map of Mars nearly 150 years ago.
It's not just a test of a landing system.
Anyhow, there should be satellites around Moon and Mars at least, that act as relay stations. In case of landings on Mars, let us watch live (with delay) landings. I guess until Musk and Bezos start doing things, emphasis on first one, we will not have good space program.
Edit: The orbiter component of this mission also acts as a relay.