Ask HN: Hiring at crummy wage – how to make it better? | Hacker News Reader

Ask HN: Hiring at crummy wage – how to make it better?

7 pointsbassmaster19 comments

In short: I've recently started a small game studio and I was considering bringing in an artist as an employee.

Now, we're still a little way off getting any real money in (consulting is the majority right now), so I have worked out I can afford to pay not really more than around £20-25k/pa. At least initially.

I was hoping to offset this somewhat with the following:

* 35 hour weeks max

* 40 days holiday/pa

* Work remotely

* Some budget for training etc

* Some equity TBC

* Decent wage jump in the future

The last one depends on the applicant not thinking we're full of crap of course.

Other relevant info: this is in the northern UK, so whilst still lower, this is not comparing against SV wages.

Does this sound at least somewhat reasonable to you? Alternatively, what would you want to see that would make you consider such an offer? If indeed anything!

View on HN

> this is in the northern UK --

The profile you are looking for is the young kid, who needs the space to exercise his talents. This person is most likely not 'looking' for work. They merely love creating, tinkering, & gaming. Actually getting paid is a bonus. Think Steve Jobs @ Atari> http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/127537/Steve_Jobs_Atari_E...

You will find them by networking with teachers/professors even a sports coach. Anyone who works with young people. Incidentally, managing this talent also requires special skills.

Is it possible to hire a young, newly qualified(?) artist for the role but also spend some money on training and mentoring? Aside, do artists need/benefit from a qualification for a role like this?

Or hire a mother that is returning to the workforce. Choices can be very limited for people that need to pick up the kids after school and take time off during holidays. There's a massive pool of talent in that demographic.

I know of a marketing company that hired a mother recently. 3-4 days a week and come in hour later and go out hour earlier. She put to shame all 20something young guns. High quality work and fast.

That's why they call it work . . . (Lots of people work for a crummy rate, I think about it, it bothers me, do what you can to be a good employer and improve lives.)

I know I'd like to pay everyone six figures but market rates apply . . .

Avoid the headaches and cost, don't hire an employee . . .

Use contractors as long as you can. Take what you'd pay them as an employee and pay them above market rate for small gigs.

Distribute holiday pay as bonuses for work well done.

This will keep them happy and coming back to you plus you can try different people out and have someone in mind when you do grow to the point where you need someone full time.

I expect you could use contract employees even as you grow as I expect artists/graphics work could be completed as bundles of work.

Avoid hiring a full time employee . . . until it's absolutely necessary.

Paying a contractor more than market rate and nice bonuses would make you a great employer and build loyal contractors that will stick around.

Good luck with your game studio.

If you have an interesting game coming out post it here.

Especially Space, Sci-Fi and strategy games = )

I'd look at hiring remotely. But I would see if I could split initial elements up into smaller contract tasks and hire people piecemeal to get a sense of work product for remote employees, and make the best of them an offer.

We've tried this but so far they all prefer the contracting life - and we need some consistency rather than switching contractors often as they pick up new work or just vanish.

There should be a website for crummy wages...

I wouldn't mind exchanging some money for a remote job with more (then usual) freedom and a humane team/owner.

I would keep it simple

1. Figure out what the market is for the normal work-week.

2. Scale the work-week until you can afford it.

3. When you can afford more, add more hours.

Could you clarify something for me? How do you have budget for training that couldn't go into salary?

Well it could, but then there'd be nothing left for training.

Create a story around your vision, product and team. People will pursue opportunities for less income if the opportunities help them achieve their goals or align with their values. I can't tell you what your story is, but here are a couple examples to get you started.

We're a small group of extremely driven, passionate game developers that like to have fun while we work.

We're a small, humble studio with plans for world domination, our game EFG has XYZ growth metric and we need you to help us scale to the next level. We expect you to grow into a team lead and manage ABC aspects of our business.

We're building the next generation gaming platform that is exciting because of XYZ.

We're industry veterans from XYZ famous companies building games focused on X because of ABC compelling reasons.

I've hired a brilliant young man at low pay (but appropriate for entry-level). 32 hour work week, flexible schedule (he starts at one p.m.), plus profit sharing on side projects and I'm mentoring him.

He spent the first two months studying, at my expense, to qualify as a novice sysadmin and gain a contract at my client.

This arrangement is working for us both. He's making more than ever before.

He's asked me to 2x his rate on the next contract.

>He's asked me to 2x his rate on the next contract.

I don't understand your implication? Is this a good or bad thing?

I wasn't implying anything, just sharing my experience. He's doing valuable work. I can definitely get him a higher rate now that he has a year of experience. Not sure I can double it. I'll try!

Hire (out of country) remotely. For some it's a very good wage (it was once for me too).

I had considered that but it's a bit of a headache for a FTE at our size. Might be worth looking again if all else fails though.

Other possible benefits are flexibility in schedule and profit sharing.

If you want a real perk due like 20 days of mandatory vacation.

Not sure what you mean? There'd be 40 days of paid vacation without any onerous conditions other than perhaps taking day 1-40 off.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com