Eating a manchineel “beach apple” (2000) | Hacker News Reader

Eating a manchineel “beach apple” (2000)

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

98 pointsdonquichotte72 comments

I simply cannot imagine picking an unidentified piece of fruit from the ground and eating it.

There are berries in the northeast that look much like cranberries, but as a kid I was told they are deadly poisonous. Regardless of the accuracy of that warning, the basic concept should hold: if you don't know what it is, don't assume it is safe.

This is why I've learned how to identify wild plants. I've been surprised on a few occasions by people unable to identify plums and cherries growing wild. But if you can't identify wild plants you shouldn't eat them.

Wild mushrooms are harder to identify. Other than the few I can readily identify on sight, I use an identification guide. There have been several cases of people (almost always from the Far East) inadvertently dying after eating death caps (Amanita phalloides) which I've read taste delicious but are fatal, and can take days to kill:

http://www.iwcp.co.uk/news/second-mushroom-victim-critical-i...

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-01-04/two-die-from-death-cap...

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-06-08/woman-dies-after-eatin...

They mistake them for paddy straw mushrooms (Volvariella volvacea) which look identical and are used in Chinese and Thai cuisine. They can be distinguished by spore colour but a better way is to check it came out of a tin before eating them.

I think the problem is less so identifying plums and cherries and more so identifying that they are not something which looks like a plum or cherry but is poisonous. I know what common fruits look like; I don't know which fruits don't have poisonous doppelgangers in my region.

abc.net.au links - are you in Australia?

I live in Tasmania and have been meaning to find an edible field guide to mushrooms or some such. Mushrooms here in Launceston are frequently popping out of the ground in my front and backyard and on the grass verges by the road, and if you walk anyway in the national parks and state forests you're up to your knees in mushrooms.

Would love to know if any of them are edible.

I'm in England, but there are death caps in Australia, which unfortunately were introduced along with oak trees.

You need an identification guide for your area (Tasmania, or perhaps all of Australia). Unless you can safely identify the species, you cannot be sure it is safe to eat, and should discard it. Identification is usually done using a dichotomous key, which involves checking for the presence or absence of a characteristic (which involves understanding some jargon), then another, until you're down to genus level. Then you check visually to identify the species. It's a bit like an expert system, except printed in a book.

In some countries in continental Europe, you can take wild mushrooms to a pharmacist for identification.

More than an identification guide, you need an experienced friend or someone who knows what they're doing. There are way too many poisonous mushrooms that look like edible ones (death cap/inky cap).

> More than an identification guide ...

Better than just an identification guide ...

This.

It just baffles me that a reasonably intelligent person would eat unknown fruit found in the wild in a foreign country.

If everybody had been as cautious as you two, nothing much would've happened.

There is a protocol for sampling unknown foods that I suspect aboriginal humans might have developed ad hoc. http://www.wikihow.com/Test-if-a-Plant-Is-Edible

I've seen military manuals with basically the same procedure recommended. I wonder if there are some commonly known dangerous plants that would've slipped through these cracks.

Potato seeds slipped through the cracks for centuries! http://www.newyorker.com/books/page-turner/chris-mccandless-...

From the link: "Eat 1/4 cup of the same kind of plant part prepared the same way."

My father spent the last ten years of his career as an ethnobotanist (having previously been a government archaeologist) and his advice was increase the amount by doubling it with each subsequent test. Going from one piece of a leaf to 1/4 cup is a little bit too much of a leap, IMHO.

Also feeding it to animals. Might be a tad bit more inhumane and you could run into an issue with some animals that are able to eat poisonous food without issue, but sure is a lot nicer than accidentally dying yourself, I suppose.

> If everybody had been as cautious as you two, nothing much would've happened.

The time for eating unidentified fruit is when you are dying of starvation.

> If everybody had been as cautious as you two, nothing much would've happened.

No, actually they would have probably improved human knowledge after conducting the autopsy on your body and examined what you had carelessly ingested... ;) j/k

From TFA: "Perhaps few adults (especially a medically qualified one) would be foolish enough to try eating an unknown fruit found on a foreign beach, but children would be highly likely to do so, especially when they find it to smell and taste sweet, resembling a ripe plum."

It's really more of an advisory.

Life is weird, and sometimes natural selection fires a warning shot...

Sounds like alcohol might have been involved.

Growing up in the NorthEast, I can say I've eaten many random berries, from the ones that grow on forsythia to the pimento looking ones that grow on shrubbery.

I think I've been pretty lucky; however, I did always avoid (wild) mushrooms...

I'm pretty sure I was told those pimento ones were poisonous as a kid.

Me to. Haven't thought about it in ages. Does anyone know what they are and if they're poisonous ?

It looks like they're these:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxus_baccata

Looks like the berries are technically edible, minus the seeds...

It didn't say that they ate it, just tasted a sample of it. That's a little safer. There are many poisonous plants, but usually you need to eat an nontrivial amount for it to be lethal. And most poisonous plants (but not all!) will taste bitter, an evolutionary adaption to protect us from this.

That said it's still stupid, if you aren't starving, to risk this.

You probably shouldn't even pick up fruit you can identify. My wife and I visited Puna in Hawaii, and she kept eating mangos from under trees. Later that year, I saw this article [1] where a guy caught a nasty case of "rat lungworm disease" [2] from working on an organic farm in the same area. To quote the article, "Something as simple as eating an unwashed strawberry may have been how Reinert contracted the disease."

[1] http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2013/02/17/mn-man-determined-t... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angiostrongylus_cantonensis

Rat lungworm comes from the slime from snails (maybe slugs too). Presumably you peeled the mangos and didn't eat any exposed flesh which would have been overripe and discolored. It's the unwashed raw produce in Hawaii that has a risk of rat lungworm in Hawaii. And the snails, but presumably you didn't eat any snails either, though they are large and edible when properly cooked.

However, the skin of mangos contain trace amounts of a toxin similar to that in poison ivy/oak, and some people can react to it in their skins--though not life threatening.

There are some things in Hawaii which can kill you. If the article author had taken the same bite from the be-still fruit (Cascabela thevetia), she'd most likely be dead. A couple of others too: castor bean (ricin) and black-eye Susan beans (can't remember the exact name). They're all plants that were imported as ornamentals and are now spreading invasively. Edited to add: some native plants can be dangerous as well: all parts of the taro plant must be cooked to get rid of oxalic acid cristals which will severely irritate your mouth and throat.

The author of the original article is truly a Darwin Award seeker, something about tropical vacations make people leave their brains at home--they take the tropical paradise meme far too literally. Though I guess we now have an accurate medical paper on the effects of the manchineel.

Errata: it's calcium oxalate crystals in taro and related plants that cause irritation and rashes, not oxalic acid.

>> I simply cannot imagine picking an unidentified piece of fruit from the ground and eating it.

I absolutely share your astonishment. It seems reckless beyond all justification, especially given that this incident occurred in a land foreign to the author. I'd like to give the author props for having the courage to write about it, but something about the "warning to the world" tone at the end makes me suspicious that he or she doesn't know most people wouldn't do this.

I agree with this sentiment as a well-informed adult. As the proud owner of a 1.5-year old son who will attempt to eat absolutely anything, I am glad to have read this so I know what to aggressively and proactively remove from his field of vision.

Really? Am I so weird that I don't just pop random things I find on the ground into my mouth? The statement, "I rashly took a bite from this fruit and found it pleasantly sweet. My friend also partook (at my suggestion)." demonstrated at least two evolutionary negative traits; first eating random things when not starving, second not waiting to observe the effects of eating an unknown substance by someone silly enough to try it. That is right up there with trying to hold the brightly colored snake and big fuzzy spider.

The boy scouts drive this into you as well.

There's a protocol for eating unknown plants if you are starving to death in the wilderness. Otherwise, don't.

The protocol: introduce it in tiny quantities, starting with "touch it to your arm", and wait for hours watching for a reaction. Then touch it to the outside of your lip - do not eat it - and wait. Etc.

Not "Bite it and see if it tastes good. Don't mind the burning sensation."

The point of 'taste' is generally to find things safe to eat. It's not a 'random thing from the ground', but a fruiting body, which is almost universally safe to eat if it is sweet and not bitter.

Except the fruit in this article was sweet, AND highly toxic. I really don't think there is any scientific basis for the claim "safe if it's sweet".

That's exactly why this tree is so notorious. It's actually very very rare to be both sweet and toxic.

Things in the natural world that nourish an animal generally appeal to that animal. It's why you find rotten flesh and faeces repulsive, but flies flock to it (and they don't flock to their own shit).

> The point of 'taste' is generally to find things safe to eat.

Well, there were coconuts and mangoes around too, but our "medical" person chose to sample the only one he didn't know anything about.

Alaskans have this thing they say about Darwin and natural selection. I Just don't recall how they frame it

Parts of the mango tree have urushiol in them. It's the same irritant that is in poison ivy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mango#Potential_for_contact_de...

Cavalier picking of mangoes could also lead to unpleasant consequences.

As noted in that article, you have to be a special case to be affected by parts of the mango tree. From my experience, you really have to be a special case.

> Perhaps few adults (especially a medically qualified one) would be foolish enough to try eating an unknown fruit found on a foreign beach

That's what was going through my mind for the whole story. And then to sit around sipping piña coladas as their symptoms worsened? Quite an unbelievable story, true or not.

I bet they had a few pina coladas before this episode, as well as after.

It's not just the fruit, contact with the leaves is similar to contact with poison ivy or poison oak. Sometimes people take shelter under the tree when it rains and end up in bad shape.

I led a program for teens in the Caribbean one summer. One of my teens took a shit in the woods on an island, and unknowingly wiped his ass with a leaf from this tree. It was a long 5 weeks for him.

Some of the trees in the more touristy areas are marked with warning signs:

http://www.flownet.com/ron/trips/Amazon/Pages/526.html

Not only do the signs warn you not to eat the fruit, but also not to stand under the tree when it rains!

> but also not to stand under the tree when it rains!

Why? According to the sign: "It is also not recommended to take shelter under this tree when it rains, water that runs off the leaves is corrosive"

Frightening!

Dammit! The fruit looks so delicious!

That's very helpful. Thanks for the link.

> Sadly, the pain was exacerbated by most alcoholic beverages, although mildly appeased by pina coladas

This is a crucial finding. Clearly, public authorities in Caribbean countries must now install refrigerators stocked with piña colada on all public beaches, as an urgent matter of public safety.

If you are in a survival situation and need to know if something is edible, use the Universal Edibility Test: http://pdf.textfiles.com/manuals/MILITARY/united_states_army...

(Do not repeat do not eat unknown fungi even using this test)

1 Test only one part of a potential food plant at a time.

2 Separate the plant into its basic components -leaves, stems, roots, buds, and flowers.

3 Smell the food for strong or acid odors. Remember, smell alone does not indicate a plant is edible or inedible.

4 Do not eat for 8 hours before starting the test.

S During the 8 hours you abstain from eating, test for contact poisoning by placing a piece of the plant part you are testing on the inside of your elbow or wrist. Usually 15 minutes is enough time to allow for a reaction.

6 During the test period, take nothing by mouth except purified water and the plant part you are testing.

7 Select a small portion of a single part and prepare it the way you plan to eat it. a Before placing the prepared plant part in your mouth, touch a small portion (a pinch) to the outer surface of your lip to test for buming or itching.

9 If after 3 minutes there is no reaction on your lip, place the plant part on your tongue, holding it there for 15 minutes.

10 If there is no reaction, thoroughly chew a pinch and hold it in your mouth for 15 minutes. Do not swallow.

11 If no burning, itching, numbing, stinging, or other irritation occurs during the 15 minutes. swallow the food.

12 Wait 8 hours. If any ill effects occur during this period. induce vomiting and drink a lot of water.

13 If no ill effects occur, eat 0.25 cup of the same plant part prepared the same way. Wait another 8 hours. If no ill effects occur, the plant part as prepared is safe for eating.

WARNING

Do not eat mushrooms in a survival situation! The only way to tell if a mushroom is edible is by positive identification. There is no room for experimentation. Symptoms of the most dangerous mushrooms affecting the central nervous system may show up after several days have passed when it is too late to reverse their effects.

If you liked the beach apple story, perhaps you'll find this article about intentionally and regularly eating poison oak to be fascinating. https://yankeebarbareno.com/2011/03/03/eating-poison-oak/

My dad does this every year with Poison Ivy on his farm. Claims it works.

If you are going to pick up or poke, or scariest of all - taste, the local flora and fauna without first checking with a local, then I predict a very short existence for you in most tropical zones, or here in Australia...

Or Yellowstone. Very little of the wildlife there is petable. At least not more than once.

Page 1/14 each having a few lines? Must be one of the worst mobile version I've encountered in a long time.

The pdf link produces a nice mobile experience.

There is some good additional detail in this article, too: http://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/whatever-you-do-do-not-...

If you've ever wondered what evolutionary pressures make some fruits poisonous to humans/mammals, and some delicious, here is a good write up.

http://www.kew.org/discover/blogs/archived-blogs/trouble-par...

And a book from the same author:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fruit-Inedible-Incredible-Wolfgang-...

Maybe the most frightening thing is that this person apparently went through medical training and never learned rudimentary field biology. Tour guides in wild areas all over the world have a "this is not Disney World" or equivalent mantra. Life is not like television, unless it is the right television. As a child I watched https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_Across_the_Everglades where the Burl Ives character kills a man by tieing him to a manchineel tree and will forever remember him wickedly proclaiming "The manchineel tree, the only tree that can carve its initials in you".

So what should the protocol be then? First rub a little of the juice on the skin, wait a few hours, and see if it stings? And if not, then proceed, but how?

From another comment: http://www.wikihow.com/Test-if-a-Plant-Is-Edible

Survival protocol for unknown fruits and berries is to rub a small amount on your bottom lip and wait a while. Then ingest a small amount and wait a while. Increase amount you're eating while monitoring effects and 'output'...

Please note, this is not professional advice - if you try this and die or spend 9 days on the throne I'm not responsible. It's a survival technique, intended for use when not eating anything will kill you, while eating the wrong thing might kill you.

Cool article. I wonder if the beach had any pertinent information/signage regarding the fruit. Obviously if the locals are aware then they wouldn't need it, but visitors would probably appreciate it. I wonder if it's more helpful to put information directly at the beach, or back at the airport in documentation in a variety of languages that people can carry with them?

Traveling in a foreign country, a "medical" person found "some green fruits among the scattered coconuts and mangoes lying on the beach" and proceeded to eat the only one (s)he has never eaten before.

Fast forward a decade.

That medical person is now a surgeon. While performing routine surgery, our "medical" person saw a lump he'd never seen or read about before.

Guess what Einstein did?

(S)he.... ate it? Not sure where you were going with that story.

Before my honeymoon in Barbados I read a travel guide. It was mentioned not to shelter under one during rain. I don't think the ones we saw were bearing fruit at the time. All of them were marked with a dark read stripe painted on them.

So, having medical training fails to provide you with the most basic survival skills.

What the heck is up with the pagination on that site? I'm befuddled as to why anyone thought it was a good idea to spend any amount of effort on that...

"We ate a weird fruit and got poisoned. True story."

Why is this on the front page of Hacker News?

I guess it helps you to remember that no matter how reasonably logical you think people might be, there are plenty of people out there who will eat random food they find off the ground

So, in the context of Hacker News, is it an analogy of how we tend to dive head first into new technologies which some times end up poisoning us? ;}

34 comments so far, some of us find it interesting.

I found it interesting too. I just don't understand why it's on this site. I'd expect it on Reddit maybe.

Darwin loves you.

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